Best Of

Just to be clear - I don't want this to devolve into an argument about whether or not you agree with this premise. That isn't the point, the point here is I want to implement systems that everyone wants to participate in. 

I don't want to spend time on a system that doesn't get used because people for whatever reason, don't want to use it. My concerns listed here are based on my experience and the complaints I've received. This isn't an invitation to start discussing the validity of those complaints, but instead an invitation to develop ideas that everyone is willing to be a part of and participate in.

Sheesh, 

I'm pointing out my concern about implementing a solution here given what I've seen from the playerbase.

If we implement a wargames system (cross-org or not) that rewards winning, then I'm concerned that players are going to opt-out and not even try because they're going to see some team from whatever side that is participating that they don't think they can beat and rather than try, they're going to say 'they're going to win anyway, why should I bother'

That's my concern about implementing this. It's a concern because it's been brought up to me before. I don't agree that Shadowlight (as is being claimed here) cannot get a top run in Grimkeep and I wouldn't agree that Shadowlight wouldn't be able to win any kind of smaller scale PvP system that's implemented.

It doesn't matter what I believe though, it matters what players believe. Players have shown that they don't want to participate in things that they feel benefit the 'other' side.  There are accusations that I haven't listened, but my concerns here are literally because I've listened. Just because I don't agree with the reasoning does not mean I'm not listening. This isn't just limited to Grimkeep, it's cropped up in other areas as well.

Unlike a lot of stuff in lusternia like domoths, villages, etc, Grimkeep isn't a zero sum game - other people doing well doesn't take anything away from you. You still earn dailycredits and piles of essence for your own runs, even if they're not record-breaking, and you can put that towards new artifacts or wonderitems to help you do better in future runs.

For the Wargames system, tie the benefits only to the winners. Remove the org-aspect entirely. You already see some cross-org participation in GK because of this. Not-winning costs you nothing, but winning gives you... some reward. Credits, personal bashing buffs, a bright-eyed dweller that follows you around and tells everyone you're the best.

Luxurio said:

Is anyone ever going to tell us why things are lopsided? Other than talking about artifacts because lol no.

Yes, artifacts are a huge impact. Level 3 vitality, level 3 regeneration runes, damage buffs against mobs, damage resistances, wondersaddles, increase exp gains to give more perks that give more regen/dmg/resistances. To claim otherwise is ignorant. Why do you always poke the bear

Honestly, I'm not opposed to any of these ideas - of having some sort of formal wargames system that promotes small group PvP.

My big concern though is if we spent time coding this - would it get used or would it just languish there like combat rankings?

There's already a big issue with people not participating in something because they feel like it benefits the 'other' side so they'd rather not engage at all than do anything that could help them (This obviously ignores that by not participating, the other side reaps all the rewards anyway).