Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
There's no argument to be made there, because ultimately this is a game, and people have the right to act so they can enjoy that game. So if they have OOC motivations to make sure they continue to enjoy that game then so be it. As long as they deal with it in character.
Have they given someone an IC reason why they were rejected? If yes, then the debate is over. The fact you don't like that is irrelevant, the fact they OOCly don't want someone there is, irrelevant. Their character has a reason to not want you there, and ultimately that's the only thing that matters.
If you're then going to ignore IC because of OOC, or circumvent IC because of OOC, you're metagaming. If Celina ICly rejects someone, you can't negate that IC reason because OOCly their player also doesn't want said person, you don't get to pick and choose which bits of IC you have to accept and which you don't.
Again, clarifying for the 100th time, I have no intention of telling anyone how to play the game.
Celina is entitled to play the game how she wants, but she is not entitled to make untrue claims, such as her behaviour being beneficial for the game and its players.
I am disagreeing with Celina asserting that claim, and instead making the point that it is actually unhealthy for the player experience in the long run.
You all seem to think I am scolding her morally for whatever reason or another.
@Shaddus, I have not changed the argument at all. The point remains the same. OOC vigilantism is not good for Lusternia. That has been the point from the start, that is the point at the end. I feel like I have paraphrased the same statement a hundred different ways, yet this still seems to elude you. It makes me realize that someone can be listening, but not receiving.
"A man's not dead while his name is still spoken." - Terry Pratchett 1948-2015
Viravain, Lady of the Thorns shouts, "And You would seize Me? Fool! I am the Glomdoring! I am the Wyrd, and beneath the cloak of Night, the shadows of the Silent stir!"
Seven pages? Seriously? You know, things could probably be better if all the effort put into arguing was put into what we can all do to make the game better.
You have received a new honour! Congratulations! On this day, you have shown your willingness to ensure a bug-free Lusternia for everyone to enjoy. The face of Iosai the Anomaly unfolds before you, and within you grows the knowledge that you have earned the elusive and rare honour of membership in Her Order. Curio Exchange - A website to help with the trading of curio pieces in Lusternia.
Hijacking? Good madam, we have been performing an important public service! How else are the good people of the forums to bear the sight of so circular an argument if it is not interspersed with a little light relief! I defy you all to survive the ravages of debates such as these without the soothing balm of adorableness.
Why are all these cute animal pictures here, and not in the cute pictures thread?! You had me sift through poor argumentation in order to get my daily dose of vitamin squee. Sadness. (
Everyone is a genius. But if you judge a fish on its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.
Viravain, Lady of the Thorns shouts, "And You would seize Me? Fool! I am the Glomdoring! I am the Wyrd, and beneath the cloak of Night, the shadows of the Silent stir!"
I would argue that some level of OOC vigilantism is indeed healthy for the game. You say that novices can't drive off veteran players? I'm assuming you weren't around during that absolutely beautiful influx of players we got when we were on Kongregate. When you have trolls coming in, and they start to build up, they can cause some serious damage, immersion issues aside. Those damaging behaviours aren't something to chuckle at and ignore. When people behave badly, and are not dealt with, it becomes okay for more people to behave badly. Permission is given when you don't address a problem.
A whisper from the trees and a frosty presence tells you, secretly, "But you are strong, little
flower, and wise." The voice shifts and expands, becoming more real. "And everything you just said
in the ritual made me feel safer. You should, too."
OOC Vigilantism (let me guess who came up with this term) is terrible and bad for the overall health of Lusternia, and should be dissuaded and shouldn't be happening
But I'm not going to judge or stop anyone from doing it because they are allowed to play how they want.
At least pick a side, You're trying to have your cake and eat it too.
I mean this is the same guy who snubbed me because 'he felt bullied' after he threatened (and it was a threat honey, 'if it happens again, I'll issue it' IS a threat) to issue me because I wouldn't reveal how I managed to get him off the PoS and told him to get over it. You got pissed off that you were ganked and killed so you took OOC actions to a completely and 100% IC situation because you got your panties in a bunch. But yeah, take the high road and argue this ideal RP world that you don't take part in. Don't worry though, I don't judge you or think you're a bad person because you're allowed to play how you like. Nothing personal.
(ready for the response using big words he doesn't understand the meaning of and claiming OOC dislike)
"'Cause the fighting don't stop till I walk in." -Synkarin's Lament.
2
Cyndarinused Flamethrower! It was super effective.
This thread is a really confusing mix of animal photos and arguing. I'd also just quickly point out that Tetra blatantly misquoted me as saying I don't bar others from entry, I just kick them out. Which was actually never said not have I ever done. (Though I might, admittedly). Probably because he was too busy pseudo diagnosing people with OCD, which apparently he doesn't need an education for. ALL I AM SAYING IS THIS: more bunnies
Viravain, Lady of the Thorns shouts, "And You would seize Me? Fool! I am the Glomdoring! I am the Wyrd, and beneath the cloak of Night, the shadows of the Silent stir!"
This thread is a really confusing mix of animal photos and arguing. I'd also just quickly point out that Tetra blatantly misquoted me as saying I don't bar others from entry, I just kick them out. Which was actually never said not have I ever done. (Though I might, admittedly). Probably because he was too busy pseudo diagnosing people with OCD, which apparently he doesn't need an education for. ALL I AM SAYING IS THIS: more bunnies
He does this quite a bit; he's now taken it to mean that people are kicked just for "being annoying" (to which I need only point to Athree). There we have an example of a character who was quite annoying when he started to play, but as time has gone on he has actually integrated quite well and we're pretty glad to have him around now. He is a positive and beneficial contributor.
Do you know what the difference is? The player made an effort to be a part of the whole, and not to be subversive / destructive. He has made an effort to grow the character, and it's very very obvious. There is a huge difference between an annoying character who is annoying because the player has fun being annoying, and a character who is that way because they are still learning the ropes and just have a long distance to go. When there is some hope for improvement (which, in any true newbie's case, there could and should be), the newbie needs to be embraced and guided.
It's only in the case of serial offenders who have evinced no willingness to contribute positively that this is really applied, but no, he wants to use that as a sweeping brush for "everyone is banned, noooooo". That's just not how it works.
It's getting to the point where when people make posts without cute animals in them, I'm going to start flagging these as off topic.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
I, for one, am absolutely thrilledbecause of the cute animal invasion. It has been so long since something fun came out of a forum mess.
Viravain, Lady of the Thorns shouts, "And You would seize Me? Fool! I am the Glomdoring! I am the Wyrd, and beneath the cloak of Night, the shadows of the Silent stir!"
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"A man's not dead while his name is still spoken." - Terry Pratchett 1948-2015
You have received a new honour! Congratulations! On this day, you have shown your willingness to ensure a bug-free Lusternia for everyone to enjoy. The face of Iosai the Anomaly unfolds before you, and within you grows the knowledge that you have earned the elusive and rare honour of membership in Her Order.
Curio Exchange - A website to help with the trading of curio pieces in Lusternia.
The divine voice of Avechna, the Avenger reverberates powerfully, "Congratulations, Morkarion, you are the Bringer of Death indeed."
You see Estarra the Eternal shout, "Morkarion is no more! Mourn the mortal! But welcome True Ascendant Karlach, of the Realm of Death!
06/30/2014 19:37 Silvanus channels the power of the Megalith of Doom for you, stripping you of your Vernal Ascendant status.......bastard!!
"A man's not dead while his name is still spoken." - Terry Pratchett 1948-2015
Do you know what the difference is? The player made an effort to be a part of the whole, and not to be subversive / destructive. He has made an effort to grow the character, and it's very very obvious. There is a huge difference between an annoying character who is annoying because the player has fun being annoying, and a character who is that way because they are still learning the ropes and just have a long distance to go. When there is some hope for improvement (which, in any true newbie's case, there could and should be), the newbie needs to be embraced and guided.
It's only in the case of serial offenders who have evinced no willingness to contribute positively that this is really applied, but no, he wants to use that as a sweeping brush for "everyone is banned, noooooo". That's just not how it works.