Gear Overhaul

Malayn · January 2016

I will parrot my request for the "kephera belt" to work on tattoos.

Currently tattoos is 2% stronger than splendors. People cite "but tattoos do 3% more resist" but kephera already have the mini forcefield and are readily better defensively.

To say your trans skill means you get less options (damage reduction is far worse than utility) would be kind of backward.

Cyndarin · January 2016

Kephera pay 1000 credits for that. Not really the same.

Malayn · January 2016

Tattoos is 8%, splendours are 10%, Master tattoos is 12%. You currently spend 300 credits to gain 4% resistance is all. Kephera would be inherent 10%. Ignoring Kephera's forcefield (because of the pay wall), we are saying that Kephera should get access to knots, but tattoos shouldn't on the ground of 3% increase to resists. I think I would trade that resist for utility, especially if you are a noncom, and am therefore asking whatever kephera would get, we give to tattooists.

Tattoos are general, but specifically defense tats are buffed by 3% on monks. Kephera are general, with mini forcefield (25% at demi+).

The 300 credit investment is a price that grants the increase from 8% to 12%, while I am saying we should leave knots general.

Don't like the idea of punishing peoples utility because they took a trade their class is specialized for. I am not asking (as kephera likely isn't) for max knots, but when it makes more sense to leave tattoos because of splendours advantages, I figure we have a mismatch. Note that kephera in actual splendours would have the same advantages, while their forcefield may or may not work (I have no idea).

I am attempting to avoid a situation where taking an alternative trade punishes you, when anyone should have utility access.

Cyndarin · January 2016

Well you're comparing apples and oranges between a racial perk and a trade skill, which still makes no sense.

That being said, I don't really have any issue with a knots system for tattoos. Tattoos are designed to be better than splendours in every way, so I don't see an issue with keeping the status quo.

I am asking for max knots to mirror splendours, for the record.

Qistrel · January 2016

Correct me if I'm wrong, cause I haven't used forged armour or enchanted robes for a while...but didn't robes have two proofings because their physcial stats were worse than forged armour? Whereas after this overahaul, robes and armour will have the same number of slots, so there is nothing to make up for robes having less stats. Plus warriors have significantly more health than casters already. Won't this make warriors far better at bashing than casters?

Was the concept of robes being less physically protective but more magically protective forgotten along the way, or am I missing something?

Cyndarin · January 2016

Warriors have always been beefier/better at bashing because of surge (which had the tradeoff of lower mana). Now they just moved the health buff from surge (and surge more or less useless) to a passive health buff and gave mages/guardians mana and bards ego. I raised this issue when they were released, that warriors lost the downsides of having the largest health stat and casters were given much less valuable buffs to mana and ego. It was largely ignored.

In fact, because warriors were overwhelmingly aslaran, they had very similar or smaller health pools than many caster races unless the caster specifically chose wump/merian. If they went kephera/lucidian/dracnari/etc, mages often had larger health pools.

Robe wearers can have 2 more proofs than warriors (since you can proof coats and robes) and the proofings don't cover most damage types. The 3% reduction to two damage types from a very limited pool, I think, isn't significant. I don't mind them having the same number of slots available because the difference before was pretty miniscule.

The health discrepancy should be addressed though. Or warriors need a mana malus to maintain the status quo.

Rivius · January 2016

It's actually a lot more complicated than that. Tankiness in terms of raw health is not necessarily equivalent to greater survivability. Indeed, guardians, bards and monks can be a whole lot harder to kill in the current game than a warrior because of the abilities afforded to them. This has been true both before and after the overhaul. The design was specifically made so that each class excels in a particular vital, but part of the overhaul design was also to minimize on maluses that made the game uneven. I see no reason why warriors should become mana fodder again, when no one else faces any real maluses of their own. That's just taking a step backwards.

Not to mention, you're misrepresenting things, of course. Under the new system, the gulf between warriors and other classes is not as large as it used to be. Furthermore, warriors operated like this under the old system: 1) Either you played a high con race that naturally had bad mana or 2) Played a race like aslaran that was balanced in HP and could surge for very high health and maintain a very good mana pool still. Aslaran warriors had incredibly high health, and I certainly don't remember there being any comparison between even Aslaran warriors and the guardian/mage races you listed.

And I'll say, I'm already extremely exasperated with what's coming in the form of the warrior overhaul. It's already going to be a very big undertaking for warrior envoys to make the class viable, smooth and fun again when it hits. This is really the least of my worries, personally.

Qistrel · January 2016

-backs away slowly-

Malayn · January 2016

Rivius said:

And I'll say, I'm already extremely exasperated with what's coming in the form of the warrior overhaul. It's already going to be a very big undertaking for warrior envoys to make the class viable, smooth and fun again when it hits. This is really the least of my worries, personally.

Isn't the idea that you should be fixing the warrior overhaul now? Not release broken or unusable? Thought that is why they are in area already.

Many people should be able to reach 8 health from "common" sources (including things like domoth racial health though).

Cyndarin · January 2016

edit: Nevermind. My intent is to maintain the status quo, not rewrite things to favor our guilds/archetypes as the overhaul goes along. That's what the Celest envoys did, I feel like it's pretty much what the warrior envoys are doing right now. If it's wrong for Celest, it's wrong for everyone. If you want to keep the best vital, as you had previously, you should have a downside, as you had previously. Anything else is taking advantage of an oversight.

Rivius · January 2016

Malarious said:

Rivius said:

And I'll say, I'm already extremely exasperated with what's coming in the form of the warrior overhaul. It's already going to be a very big undertaking for warrior envoys to make the class viable, smooth and fun again when it hits. This is really the least of my worries, personally.

Isn't the idea that you should be fixing the warrior overhaul now? Not release broken or unusable? Thought that is why they are in area already.

Many people should be able to reach 8 health from "common" sources (including things like domoth racial health though).

Unfortunately, getting other warrior envoys and older warriors to test out the system and provide feedback has been about as fun as slamming my fingers in a door. So no, it'll likely get released in its current state and whoever still cares will have to fix it after, through the ever fun political battlefield that is envoys. I'm probably going to need blood pressure pills this year.

Malayn · January 2016

I assume this is still because we lack the ability to properly test (updated curing).

So right now it is likely to release before we know if it is balanced and when we become obligated to test.

Riv, if you have the cure prio list you use, I can convert it over to try to test for Crown. I think Synkarin was working on MM's.

Qistrel · January 2016

There is an easy way solve the problem of monks not getting slots.

Add in tattoos that give the same utility stuff as slots. Give us Quickening (celerity buff), BodyArt (prestige buff) and InnerFire (warmth buff). Then we can't complain about not being able to get the same stuff as casters or warriors.

If there's worry about stuff doubling up, you could even make them special monk-only tattoos. That also might make us be more likely to drop a few resistance tattoos for them.

Ciaran · January 2016

I have curing for the overhaul, so if anyone wants to test their viability, send me a message.

Last I checked, it was pretty easy to go AFK for a few minutes and not worry about dying.

Qistrel · January 2016

OVERHAUL NEWS #45
Date: 1/13/2016 at 18:25
From: Ieptix the Anomaly
To : Everyone
Subj: Warriors and Gear and fill in word, Oh My!

This coming Monday, Jan. 18, we will be releasing the Overhauled Warrior
skills, as well as the updated gear system! This will also include the
new physical afflictions as restorative ice cures. At inception, only
the basic broken/mangled/amputated limb afflictions will be converted to
the new system for non-Warriors.

Details on all these updates can be found in the previous several
Overhaul news posts.

Once these updates are in, we will be working out what updates we'll be
doing for monks as well as catching up on envoy reports. The full
conversion of all physical afflictions to the new system will come
concurrently with the updates to monks.

Penned by My hand on the 7th of Urlachmar, in the year 432 CE.

Qistrel · January 2016

If we buy weapon slot runes, will we be able to double up on the Enchanted effect, making our weapons do 66% of another damage type?

Taevyn · January 2016

Qistrel said:

If we buy weapon slot runes, will we be able to double up on the Enchanted effect, making our weapons do 66% of another damage type?

You can only have one of each effect even with runes.

Gear Overhaul

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