I'm more interested in whoever thought it wasn't a bug to put tuned statues in a timequake.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
I'm going to drop it down to 1 min to get credit for org and daily credits to see how it plays out.
I don't want to lower it to just entering because I think we might get a lot of people that just jump in and jump out to get credit. I want to encourage participation.
I'm more interested in whoever thought it wasn't a bug to put tuned statues in a timequake.
Yeah, I bugged that as soon as I ascertained that it was possible, and it was just about IMMEDIATELY classified as 'High'. ... Maybe I should have also destroyed the statue, but I didn't actually think of it at the time.
I'm Lucidian. If I don't get pedantic every so often, I might explode.
So what you're saying is that you built a statue, took the time to enchant it (a channeled action, 5-10 minutes), put runes on it, and then thought "you know, maybe this shouldn't be possible outside org territory"?
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
Per the AB, the restrictions on where statue can be enchanted and tuned are as follows: You cannot enchant a statue located in aether manses. Nothing about org territory in there. I could enchant a line of statues from the North gates of Magnagora all the way up to the peak, and nothing mechanical would stop me. Tuned statues outside of org territory are nothing new, they're just not typical.
I'm Lucidian. If I don't get pedantic every so often, I might explode.
The only requirement for statues is that it be an 'urban' area (white or goldish-brown) rooms, essentially city rooms or roads. I do think however, statues shouldn't be doable in timequakes. I have another suggestion for possibly making timequakes more PvP friendly. Instead of entering a rift and going to a random room, let the rift put you in a guaranteed saferoom, a la aetherplex. This lets everyone enter the rift to group up, then move as a unit into a new random room. Can be as simple as making org/daily credits not count the safe room as being in the quake.
I had a suggestion like this, that instead of limiting it to just one they'll spawn on a timer and become available, thus either allowing people to contest or split up.
I'm always up to listen to ideas though. Otherwise, we'll keep trying to battle this perception that you can't compete and try to change it to a feeling that you can compete. Next up is Mages (and we're not pushing it back any further), so if there's ideas that can be intertwined with them at the same time, now's the time to suggest them.
You are of course right, except there's a bit of equivocation over what it might mean to 'compete'.
It is completely the case that the admin decide the rewards and the means to gain those rewards. The staff did not have to opt for a system of one at a time anomalies.
The admin could have, and I am not saying should have, gone with a system that distributed resources (anomalies) less zero sum, but, still unevenly with a lions share going to the winners.
It is the admin who chose to do this and by doing so creates the situation where competing tends to make sense only if you or your allies can 'win'. This relegates 'losing' often to simply not participating.
At the very least it is the admin who have imposed reward system after reward system which rather than just disadvantaging you and your org for not placing first locks you out of all rewards for that participation.
For insance, and this is just off the top of my head. The rifts could have had a type of energy. That energy builds up on any individuals present. For giggles we'll call that 'thetans'. Too many thetans have negative consequences (whether to much is during a single event or not is a design decision). People can remove the 'thetanic' energy by using a device at a guild (or some other mechanic).
70% percent of rift resources would be gained this way, the other 30 percent (still a large chunk) by releasing anomalies.
The result is now you have greatly undermined just holding up with a superior group. Either you're sharing a cut of what you'll get or you have to get off your ass and attack the other group on their and not your terms.
And perhaps the admin can figure out a way to not reward this at 100%.
It would be cool if we could focus on making sure lower population orgs are able to get anomalies before we make sure the higher population orgs are able to afford higher research.
If all the orgs aren't getting anomalies now then some simply are not sharing.
The gains seem roughly 50/50 to me, possibly even less for the Glom side currently.
Per the AB, the restrictions on where statue can be enchanted and tuned are as follows: You cannot enchant a statue located in aether manses. Nothing about org territory in there. I could enchant a line of statues from the North gates of Magnagora all the way up to the peak, and nothing mechanical would stop me. Tuned statues outside of org territory are nothing new, they're just not typical.
I'm relatively sure that a few years ago, people were stopped from enchanting statues outside org territory because some wise guy runed and tuned a lot of statues on the roads during an ascension event. I may be imagining things.
I stand corrected. You can in fact enchant and tune statues on road.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
@Orael, given this thread's tittle includes testing, I would suggest this thread be closed and a new one started. Given that people who did not or wished not to be testers may have just wrote this thread off.
Yeah, statues outside of org territories are disabled during world events.
That's what I'm probably remembering!
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
@Orael As an aside, can we please not make it require Broadcast in Planar for timequake stuff? It requires Broadcast to be heard from a rift, or Broadcast to hear someone not in a rift if you are in one.
Hi, since this thread is still open and it's about timequakes I thought I'd go ahead and share my thoughts, since they've been out for a while.
Against my predictions, I think timequakes so far have been a really healthy addition to the game. Low stakes, no-exp-loss PvP is attracting people that I never would've thought would PvP in my life. This past week there's been at least one good fight a day (exhausting, but at least in a good way). The mechanics of anomalies and research are a lot easier than were initially being described. I imagine there's a very good and even split of anomalies across all 6 orgs. The PK scene is popping more than it has for the past year or more. The timequake scenery is gorgeous.
I know we have a bunch of disagreements on various things, but when timequakes first came out I stated to a few other people that I thought they were going to be something that Lusternia had needed for a long time. The first couple of days didn't really deliver, but after that they've really blossomed in my mind too. It doesn't really matter a lot if "your" side loses 'cause another one's coming up, you don't actually lose much of anything for trying... it's great for a lot of reasons, and we've been having some nice fights out of it.
I still want the research upkeep costs addressed. Aside from that though, we've actually had a competitive scene and it's great. all of you.
Speaking of addressing things, my prior request of not requiring Broadcast and maybe one other suggestion I had. Can we also make it entering a rift will place you with your org members first, and if none, random location? I think it would help the PvP if you didn't just spawn in somewhere and instantly fall into a pit with enemies nearby...or in some cases...actually just appear right in front of their stack. Tl;dr
1) Not require Broadcast so people can communicate 2) Attempt to be placed with org members before random
I did my first timequake last night... and honestly it was fun! I mean, aside from the fact that I have no idea what I'm doing, or what is going on... still fun!
Knowledge is just not as good as the other. Level 1 (less mana costs in rifts) isn't great outside of select times (clotting when facing a bleed class). Level 2 (3/13 man regen) is pointless due to how easy it is to negate with musicbox. Level 3 is great if you have empowered essence already. At this point, everything L3 and higher can be good powers but are way to high in the tree to be worth it.
When you have Death (uni damage at L1, L2), faster anomaly harvestings in Harmony, and Nature's teleporting to rift is great when it is in the Inner sea (and beyond that L2 is probably going to be required), you have 3 Paths that basically have required buffs in them. Even if you are great at finding Sea rifts, L2 of Harmony probably a lot more helpful than L2 of Knowledge.
I think it would be good to relax the harsh penalty for deciding to RESEARCH END, especially if Knowledge research is going to be buffed - unless it's a super insane, irresistable buff, I feel like nobody's going to throw away their hard-earned work for it.
Imo, expand all the anomaly-processors in the game to hold all types of anomalies and relevant commodities - RESEARCH END can still take a day to complete, but it preserves your current stage of research. Obviously the powers related go inactive during the ending time, but then you can start on a new research if you want to, without just casually throwing away all your research/anomalies up til now.
Going to +1 Maligorn on this, and a possibility is if Knowledge changes -do- go through, allow one guild per org to change their research project. Will turn their current anomalies in storage into the appropriate ones being changed to, gold sovereigns remains, but commodities will not. Would have to be admin changed rather than something any of the guild leaders could do, but would allow each org to change once without harsh penalty.
There is one rather irritating thing about the timequakes... although you don't lose essence/exp from dying, you DO drain from your Divine's essence pool like with any other death.
I'm Lucidian. If I don't get pedantic every so often, I might explode.
Overall, they have been great fun, but I'm a nitpicker so I'm going to pro/con timequakes to area shardfalls in Imperian. Not going to touch on the research or skills too much or at all, we'll see.
Pros
Staggered delivery over a set time - Shardfalls dump everything at the start, which means going to take a bio break risks losing an entire event.
Frequency - Shardfalls can spawn as early as 3h. Add that onto caravans spawning in about the same time, it can be a bit much if you throw in any other conflict at all. 5h+ is pretty good.
Instanced area - No 'but he was on the edge of the area!' nonsense, for the most part.
RP - Cooler idea than "Diachaim Zit Suddenly Pops!".
Dailycredit contribution - It's hard to compare directly since shard harvesting and shardfall participation credit have been bugged since dailies came out there, but 'bug v working' gives a win to 'working'.
Cons
Squads v Rings - Squad membership clearing on death is obnoxious af. It makes sharing xp and communicating harder, all while not being quite valuable enough for people to bother.
No assist tracking - A simple thing that makes it easier to feel good about supporting the team whether or not you get the kill.
Single objective at a time - One object being harvested at a time means it's easier to fortress. Imagining having to go to one room full of totems if shardfalls were the same is ick, and melds seem similar but less upfront.
Low count - With 8 max (that I've seen) per quake, it's harder to share and harder to justify converting a spare one into archpower from time to time excepting that one of the types is getting ignored (as I understand it). This also ties into the single-objective problem, but it's not exactly the same thing (since you could send one every minute and still have the single objective at a time.
No mini-quakes - Single shards launch every 5m, so you get a lower risk/reward pk activity outside of the main conflict. You might be able to sneak some in while no one is looking, you can win just by being faster, or you might get some pk. The lower item count makes this harder to implement, though.
Ties and Notes
No XP loss - All the yes. General removal of xp loss was pretty great for Imperian PK, cause no one wants to grind for 2 hours then lose it in 5s of trying to participate in PK.
Event Accessibility - You can path track to every shardfall area. A fair number of the timequakes require a little knowledge to get there. One is more accessible, one adds a little bonus for being a skilled explorer or using the AP ability. Not sure which is better.
No drop on death - Normal shards drop on death for 10m after collection, giving a chance for a targeted takedown to get a pinata of skycandy (when people don't game it by goto home/drop 50 shard/goto area). Low anomaly count coming in again to make this a bit squickier, so it ended up in notes.
Comments
I don't want to lower it to just entering because I think we might get a lot of people that just jump in and jump out to get credit. I want to encourage participation.
So what you're saying is that you built a statue, took the time to enchant it (a channeled action, 5-10 minutes), put runes on it, and then thought "you know, maybe this shouldn't be possible outside org territory"?
You are of course right, except there's a bit of equivocation over what it might mean to 'compete'.
It is completely the case that the admin decide the rewards and the means to gain those rewards. The staff did not have to opt for a system of one at a time anomalies.
The admin could have, and I am not saying should have, gone with a system that distributed resources (anomalies) less zero sum, but, still unevenly with a lions share going to the winners.
It is the admin who chose to do this and by doing so creates the situation where competing tends to make sense only if you or your allies can 'win'. This relegates 'losing' often to simply not participating.
At the very least it is the admin who have imposed reward system after reward system which rather than just disadvantaging you and your org for not placing first locks you out of all rewards for that participation.
For insance, and this is just off the top of my head. The rifts could have had a type of energy. That energy builds up on any individuals present. For giggles we'll call that 'thetans'. Too many thetans have negative consequences (whether to much is during a single event or not is a design decision). People can remove the 'thetanic' energy by using a device at a guild (or some other mechanic).
70% percent of rift resources would be gained this way, the other 30 percent (still a large chunk) by releasing anomalies.
The result is now you have greatly undermined just holding up with a superior group. Either you're sharing a cut of what you'll get or you have to get off your ass and attack the other group on their and not your terms.
And perhaps the admin can figure out a way to not reward this at 100%.
https://ada-young.appspot.com/pastebin/sTCNt2ZG
The gains seem roughly 50/50 to me, possibly even less for the Glom side currently.
I stand corrected. You can in fact enchant and tune statues on road.
1) Not require Broadcast so people can communicate
2) Attempt to be placed with org members before random
Pros
Staggered delivery over a set time - Shardfalls dump everything at the start, which means going to take a bio break risks losing an entire event.
Frequency - Shardfalls can spawn as early as 3h. Add that onto caravans spawning in about the same time, it can be a bit much if you throw in any other conflict at all. 5h+ is pretty good.
Instanced area - No 'but he was on the edge of the area!' nonsense, for the most part.
RP - Cooler idea than "Diachaim Zit Suddenly Pops!".
Dailycredit contribution - It's hard to compare directly since shard harvesting and shardfall participation credit have been bugged since dailies came out there, but 'bug v working' gives a win to 'working'.
Cons
Squads v Rings - Squad membership clearing on death is obnoxious af. It makes sharing xp and communicating harder, all while not being quite valuable enough for people to bother.
No assist tracking - A simple thing that makes it easier to feel good about supporting the team whether or not you get the kill.
Single objective at a time - One object being harvested at a time means it's easier to fortress. Imagining having to go to one room full of totems if shardfalls were the same is ick, and melds seem similar but less upfront.
Low count - With 8 max (that I've seen) per quake, it's harder to share and harder to justify converting a spare one into archpower from time to time excepting that one of the types is getting ignored (as I understand it). This also ties into the single-objective problem, but it's not exactly the same thing (since you could send one every minute and still have the single objective at a time.
No mini-quakes - Single shards launch every 5m, so you get a lower risk/reward pk activity outside of the main conflict. You might be able to sneak some in while no one is looking, you can win just by being faster, or you might get some pk. The lower item count makes this harder to implement, though.
Ties and Notes
No XP loss - All the yes. General removal of xp loss was pretty great for Imperian PK, cause no one wants to grind for 2 hours then lose it in 5s of trying to participate in PK.
Event Accessibility - You can path track to every shardfall area. A fair number of the timequakes require a little knowledge to get there. One is more accessible, one adds a little bonus for being a skilled explorer or using the AP ability. Not sure which is better.
No drop on death - Normal shards drop on death for 10m after collection, giving a chance for a targeted takedown to get a pinata of skycandy (when people don't game it by goto home/drop 50 shard/goto area). Low anomaly count coming in again to make this a bit squickier, so it ended up in notes.