The Book of Trillialialilailaillalialia is from the character named Trilialialialialaiaila. I am sure if Bloodredi had splintered instead of Trillialialialia then the Canon would be much different and that we would look at the history of that time differently.
My example was meant to be just one of many, not meant to dictate what people should do. Sorry if it came off that way. I just love RP, which I'd call my main reason for playing muds and such. The opportunity to encourage more is like yeah, I'm getting in on this.
For whatever record there is to be had in this thread, I do RP.
If you come at me seriously and I have the time, we'll have a conversation. Most of the time between other PK centered people it ends up becoming an insult contest. But I do actually play my character, with IG family/guild/and or anyone else that cares.
I just don't have the motivation to actively go out and poke random people for RP, it's not where I get the butter for my buns.
"But paradise is locked and bolted...
We must make a journey around the world
to see if a back door has perhaps been left open."
I'll have to bow out of this conversation but before I do I just want to say a couple of things:
1) My apologies to anyone reading my initial post that felt insulted/disgusted with my comments. It was wrong of me to word it the way I did and will take the time to learn from all this. I have apologized to a couple of people via pm. I am sorry for any distress or bad feelings caused.
2) I do hope that the conversation/discussion continues in the positive track. Some of you wrote some great ideas that I will be sitting down and thinking about. Thank you very much for your advice.
3) To @Lerad, my apologies for making improper assumptions. I find your writing is difficult to follow. Having this discussion while talking, I could stop you and ask for you to clarify certain points. I cannot do that effectively with posting. I will probably go back and read them again in order to play out the arguments in my head.
4) Yes, my frustrations (and cause for posting) comes from seeing certain players make fundamental changes to my roleplaying world. They have every right to it. But the MOST frustrating thing for me is not being able to properly roleplay (or interact to defend my ideals) because there is literally no one around when I log in.
Like mentioned by others, roleplaying can be fairly individualised. While others may be having fun and a vibrant experience in the three hours they spend logged in every day, others may be having a very different, and very discouraging experience - this is possible even within the same guild, if the people around at different times are vastly different. It is fairly difficult to point at the game as a whole and try to pinpoint any one thing, or even any number of things to blame for the lack of worthwhile roleplaying that is experienced by a person, but that doesn't mean there isn't a problem, or that there are no ways to resolve them.
Not being free to log in when the game (or even just your guild) is the most active can definitely put a lot of limits on what a person can do. However, that doesn't mean nothing can be done. I'm not sure if anyone has suggested it in this thread yet, but messages and letters are an entirely valid medium for IC interaction as well. If you can never get in touch with your guild in person, you can try to start a snail-mail conversation, using messages if nothing else. You won't be able to emote and perform physical RP, but conversation can still be RP (this IS a text game, afterall) and you can even start building a presence, influencing people, or even holding sermons from that. If you find yourself unable to physically defend your ideals because of time zone problems, you can consider remote correspondence with players who may be sympathetic to your opinions. Obviously, such a method will need far more consistent roleplaying - dropping the conversation when trying to roleplay in this manner can put you right back where you started. But something is better than nothing.
@Xarcon - thank you for your apology. I am amongst those people in Lusternia's community who experience mental illness and your initial post was exceptionally hurtful and triggering for me, to the point that I have felt unable to re-approach the thread until now. I'm really glad @Zouviqil posted the resources she did and I hope they are of help to you - the only ignorance worth being ashamed of is the one that you refuse to fix.
Going back to the thread, I have more thoughts than I can post in one go so I'll just settle on addressing the lack/abundance of RP opportunities for now - this is obviously not the only issue, but I think it's one that everyone comes up against so it's worth discussing at length. If it's useful to people I'll try and tackle some other things (like creating your own plotlines and approaching lore/org tenets in interesting ways).
So the thing is that finding roleplay opportunities sounds, from a distance, like such an easy thing to do. I mean, it's a roleplaying game! Surely you must wander into your org and trip over such things at every turn.
Unfortunately, it doesn't quite work like that.
In my experience there are three main places that RP opportunities form from:
1) Admin-initiated events or God/NPC interactions/similar
This one is pretty obvious, and can be one of the most rewarding. It often brings in lore if you're into lore, or big, org-level affecting events where you get to band together with lots of other people around a moral conundrum or other things that make you really think about what your character wants and how they're feeling.
The problem is, sitting around and waiting for them to come along...that's pretty boring. Luckily, there are two more places you can find RP.
2) Other people-initiated events
If you're particularly lucky, you may get assaulted by a wall o' RP from someone else - be they in your org or outside it! - and this can open up so much. Obviously, it has the same 'waiting around' problem as the first option, so what I'd like to mention are some ways that you can encourage these awesome people to spontaneously initiate RP with you again.
a) Engage with them, even if you don't usually RP with them. The worst case scenario here is that you try RPing with them, you don't mesh well for whatever reason (be it in style or ICly) and then you don't do it again. The best case could be something as long term as leading up to a marriage or a really fun rivalry. Don't shy away just because you aren't used to RPing outside of your comfort zone, and if possible try not to let prejudice prevent you from fully engaging with the person.
b) Be an interesting and dynamic RPer. Don't just stand there smiling and nodding! Ask questions, take initiative - just because you didn't start the scene doesn't mean you can't take control of it. Take people somewhere they didn't expect to go with the interaction and you will make people want to come back to you again. Note though that it is possible to take this too far, which leads me onto my final point...
c) Don't hog the scene, but equally don't be a limp fish. Be active, not passive - even when you are not the protagonist of a scene. Your character is so interesting, and I promise you that people want to learn about them. Drop hooks for people to latch onto: tell people your secrets. I cannot emphasise enough how important that is. When you're RPing, a secret shared is WAY more fun than a secret kept. And to return to this point, let that go both ways too. Show an interest in the other person. Delve into their character - I promise you they're interesting too! - and find out more. Give people chances, and they will return this in kind.
The last place that I think engenders the most RP is perhaps the hardest to do.
3) You.
This is the one that other people have been talking about, and have given some fantastic ideas on how to initiate. One of the ones that I'd like to flag up as awesome is the use of LETTERS, because who doesn't like receiving letters? I for one bounce a little bit in my seat whenever I get one delivered.
Going out and approaching people for RP is hard, it's scary, and it's a lot of effort. It won't always work - you'll put yourself out there and no one will respond, or you'll try it and end up with RP you don't enjoy. It will happen and the most important thing is to not assume that this will always be the case. Keep trying and one day you will find someone who is so much fun to RP with that you will not regret a second of the struggle to get there.
For an extra challenge - and I'm going to hold my hands up here and say that this is one I fail at tremendously! - go out of your org and find other orgs to RP with. Be it through your alliances or with enemies, this will open you up to a whole world that you might not otherwise have touched. Some of the RPers I have the most respect for are people who do this.
Really though it comes back to what @Mysrai said about being the change you wish to see. 1 and 2 are great ways to experience RP, but they are not regular or frequent, and you need something to fill in the gaps. That something is you. It's hard, it's not always successful, but good grief is it rewarding when you succeed.
Apologies for the length of this - I hope it's helpful to people nonetheless!
So I don't know the details of the scenario that inspired this thread. What I gather is there was a big shift in the identity of a guild that didn't seem to be supported by the roleplay of the guild up to that point. That really sucks. It's exactly what drove me away from Achaea, ultimately, and I can fully empathize with the frustration of having (possibly) years of accumulated goodwill and effort tossed away. I can also empathize with the "ghost" leaders. Playing a game shouldn't feel like work, but managing the minutia of a leadership position while still remaining a visible, active, guiding influence for the org you're leading is exhausting. Heck, being a visible, active, guiding influence for your org is exhausting even without the minutia. Is there a solution? Probably just staying aware that it's all a game, and you've got to find fun where you can (this is a philosophy I apply in real life too).
Whenever I take stock of the roleplay situation and find anything lacking, I ultimately have only myself to blame. I could lament that Hallifax doesn't have the all-encompassing guiding vision of Cririk/Elostian anymore, or that Ileein and Sylandra aren't around churning out lectures and plays, but it's unfair to pin responsibility on anyone else for my own enjoyment of the game. The limiting factor is my real human difficulty making connections with people and carrying on a conversation. Filtering that through a character like Daraius makes things especially challenging (It's way easier to play a character that smiles and gives hugs. I did it for years on Achaea), but every time I manage an interaction without panicking, it's like... gold star, man. You did it.
There's some really great advice in this thread, even for someone who's been playing these games for far too long.
Playing a game shouldn't feel like work, but managing the minutia of a leadership position while still remaining a visible, active, guiding influence for the org you're leading is exhausting.
Obviously I can't sympathise with you as I'm not in a position of authority, but this whole 'muds feeling like work' thing is exactly the sort of thing which happens on games like this. The way to counter this is RP, because then you are at least having fun. If you have a discussion about guild politics and nothing comes off it, or you don't get your point across, it's not wasted because hey, at least you did something and had fun. In the end, RP helps you see things less as 'waste of time' and gives you at least one thing to be satisfied about in the end.
In my experience, just the introduction of saytext in emotes, even without any frills, does a bunch to improve/encourage RP mechanically, for me and in the games where I've seen it.
More than that, it's on the community, which starts with you. And I agree that pining after the past, even if it really was that great, tends not to accomplish much. As others have said, gotta work with what you've got.
In my experience, just the introduction of saytext in emotes, even without any frills, does a bunch to improve/encourage RP mechanically, for me and in the games where I've seen it.
More than that, it's on the community, which starts with you. And I agree that pining after the past, even if it really was that great, tends not to accomplish much. As others have said, gotta work with what you've got.
Or if possible, do it so you can emote and saytext things in different languages in the same emote, using different colours to differentiate between all languages. Also, instead of just 'you understand nothing of what person A is saying' it could just be a jumble of letters, with a few words here or thre you do recognise. I saw it on another MUD, it used, I think, a ROM, base, but... some variation here would be good. I'm not a coder though.
I want to say I saw something like that AGES ago when I tried playing Star Wars Galaxies. The wookies spoke Shyriiwook, but it came out as textual representations of groans and growls to anyone who didn't speak it.
The divine voice of Avechna, the Avenger reverberates powerfully, "The Challenge of Life has ended!"
The divine voice of Avechna, the Avenger reverberates powerfully, "Aerys stands as the Champion of Life!"
I want to say I saw something like that AGES ago when I tried playing Star Wars Galaxies. The wookies spoke Shyriiwook, but it came out as textual representations of groans and growls to anyone who didn't speak it.
Well that's quite close to what we already have but I mean like, someone saying 'This pie tastes nice' in elfen would show to a non-elfen speaker 'fjgyusud alqjfn agjdjs tastes fjghqwuts' or similar.
It's an excellent idea, but I think it should differ based on the language that's not understood. Elfen, as I understand it, would sound fairly fluid and light, so perhaps be vowel-heavy gibberish if one doesn't speak it.
The divine voice of Avechna, the Avenger reverberates powerfully, "The Challenge of Life has ended!"
The divine voice of Avechna, the Avenger reverberates powerfully, "Aerys stands as the Champion of Life!"
0
EveriineWise Old Swordsbird / BrontaurIndianapolis, IN, USA
It already does that, in a way. If someone near you is speaking a language you don't understand, you see something like, "Everiine speaks in growls and whimpers" (Loboshigaru) or "Everiine speaks in an elegant, flowing tongue" (Elfen). That's not what it actually says, of course, but you see flavor text that tries to get across the general "sound" of a foreign language you don't understand.
Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"
Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.
Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
Right. But what Haezon is suggesting is that, instead of having the entire string replaced by 'something you don't understand,' he's saying replace them with gibberish letters and such while placing a couple words in here and there that you DO manage to understand. I suppose that could be an extra mechanic added to bookbinders studying other languages: the more one understands the language, the less scrambled it would appear.
The divine voice of Avechna, the Avenger reverberates powerfully, "The Challenge of Life has ended!"
The divine voice of Avechna, the Avenger reverberates powerfully, "Aerys stands as the Champion of Life!"
With regards to languages, if the admin were to decide they wanted to implement languages more officially such as with says, they have at least two or three players who know a thing or fifty about linguistics that would be willing to work on it free of charge.
So I don't know the details of the scenario that inspired this thread. What I gather is there was a big shift in the identity of a guild that didn't seem to be supported by the roleplay of the guild up to that point. That really sucks. It's exactly what drove me away from Achaea, ultimately, and I can fully empathize with the frustration of having (possibly) years of accumulated goodwill and effort tossed away.
To be fair, I think guilds and orgs can and should change over time, as the player base changes and generations adapt. Core tenants should try to be stable, but I find cultural shifts in the MUDs to be extremely fascinating to me, as they kind of reflect how the real world changes over time. Take a look at the last 1000 years and all the changes that occurred--I'm not even talking about the post-Industrial revolution but how politics has changed over time, religion, etc. When you factor the average amount of time a player is around and also how many years pass in real world time (30 years game time = 1 year real time), you've had a game that has gone through almost 3 centuries of social change. A change to an org could be the equivalent of the Magna Carta, the Protestant Reformation, the Enlightenment, etc.
What I rather fear is a jaded player base not caring anymore and new blood just slack off on the RP side. Eunni, burnout, and lack of enforced standards end up creeping in and leads to people seeking a fresh start again elsewhere...
Before I continue the current conversation I'd like to add a bit of more advice for doing and encouraging RP, especially with quests and tradeskills. These are just suggestions, not meant to tell you what to do. Just ideas, whcih obviously you can forget if time is of the essence.
For quests.
-If you are doing a quest which requires you to lift many heavy objects back and forth (Such as towers of hanoi puzzles), add in some emotes of you huffing and puffing with the objects, adding some character to things. If they are a huge race like tae'dae or igasho, then make them carry it with one hand. Then add in something about how hard it is or easy, and let it develop. That's a general thing but... yeah.
-Express frustration with your character when you are frustrated. If you've been working on a quest and an item reset, so you have to do it again, do a few groans, a curse, stamp your feet and sulk before you go off. Tailor to your individual character how they'd respond (Sometimes Haezon kills denizens if they're being stupid or unhelpful out of frustration).
-Interfere with quests which hamper your organisation, but jazz it up a little. Add in some words, or emotes. If in a team, play it out with hand signals or... go nuts. Be Arnold and his group against the Predator.
-Hug sad denizens or slap rude ones.
-Express disgust if a denizen comes on to you if you're married or not interested.
-Express frustration if the enemy succeeds and vow to stop it next time in the name of <insert god here>.
For tradeskills, it's pretty simple and straightforward. Obviously, omit if in a hurry, and forgive me if I assume wrong things about specific trade workings.
-Wipe your forehead a few times when you're forging, emote that you check the weapon itself after every 10 forgings, etc.
-For cooking, mix cakes or batter in a bowl and then cook the item. Also roast the meat.
-During making a building, measure the wood or materials out, screw in some nails, maybe dust it off for any leftover sawdust or similar residue. Maybe emote adding your initials.
-When bookbinding, cut the paper, carve any gems, carve the wood, do things you think might go into the design
-Tailoring is one of the easiest, as you can use a measuring tape for your client, test the fabric, emote some sewing and attaching, work on the stitching, cut off extra lengths of material. Maybe add in some knitting emotes.
-Can't think of anything for the others.
Now with regards to languages.
Of course, it can just be lack of transliteration thing. But the one I'm talking about treated languages as individual skills which you could train in. You could learn more from other people just by talking as well. Not all muds are of the same engine, I know this, so a Divine's input would be helpful about now.
Retired.
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EveriineWise Old Swordsbird / BrontaurIndianapolis, IN, USA
In the past, we've suggested mechanics for Bookbinders to teach languages to others, but they were never accepted.
Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"
Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.
Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
-Interfere with quests which hamper your organisation, but jazz it up a little. Add in some words, or emotes. If in a team, play it out with hand signals or... go nuts. Be Arnold and his group against the Predator.
<more text>
Ummmm, being that people just run through quests more often than not and the other side trying to interfere needs to be fast or be left in the dust? Not going to work. Just saying there are such things as mechanical limitations to what you're suggesting. Never mind running emotes while working with quest items which are time-sensitive in the first place. Take too long emoting, end up with having to start over. By the second time, you'll just end up being too frustrated to care.
EDIT: As to languages, I do recall playing a heavy RP mud where you could theoretically learn a language simply by listening others talk in it. That said, it would take RL months of people going at it for perfection in such a fashion, but still... it was something. The other interesting bit in that regard was the existence of accents. Like even if you were speaking say... elfen, but your character was originally created in Glomdoring, you'd be speaking with an accent that would identify you to a listener who is familiar with the Glomdoring accent as someone who comes from there. On the other hand, listening to an accent would mean that you would eventually be able to master THAT as well and pretend to be from somewhere else.
Forgiveness is the fragrance that the violet sheds on the heel that has crushed it.
-Interfere with quests which hamper your organisation, but jazz it up a little. Add in some words, or emotes. If in a team, play it out with hand signals or... go nuts. Be Arnold and his group against the Predator.
<more text>
Ummmm, being that people just run through quests more often than not and the other side trying to interfere needs to be fast or be left in the dust? Not going to work. Just saying there are such things as mechanical limitations to what you're suggesting. Never mind running emotes while working with quest items which are time-sensitive in the first place. Take too long emoting, end up with having to start over. By the second time, you'll just end up being too frustrated to care.
It's just some suggestions. But when I'm doing a quest, a neutral one say, or in a village, and I can take my time with it, it helps to add in a few emotes. Especially if waiting is needed for certain objects. Like I said, it's just there to help when possible, not meant to be used all the time. Can even be used when you're on your own. It doesn't have to be a paragraph either. Tailor it to your own needs, and if you don't want todo it, fine. Others might.
Retired.
0
EveriineWise Old Swordsbird / BrontaurIndianapolis, IN, USA
-Interfere with quests which hamper your organisation, but jazz it up a little. Add in some words, or emotes. If in a team, play it out with hand signals or... go nuts. Be Arnold and his group against the Predator.
<more text>
Ummmm, being that people just run through quests more often than not and the other side trying to interfere needs to be fast or be left in the dust? Not going to work. Just saying there are such things as mechanical limitations to what you're suggesting. Never mind running emotes while working with quest items which are time-sensitive in the first place. Take too long emoting, end up with having to start over. By the second time, you'll just end up being too frustrated to care.
It's just some suggestions. But when I'm doing a quest, a neutral one say, or in a village, and I can take my time with it, it helps to add in a few emotes. Especially if waiting is needed for certain objects. Like I said, it's just there to help when possible, not meant to be used all the time. Can even be used when you're on your own. It doesn't have to be a paragraph either. Tailor it to your own needs, and if you don't want todo it, fine. Others might.
And you never know what might happen. Once, when doing the Estelbar quest, I stopped to tell Billa what I was doing, and an admin responded by having Billa get all gushy and thank me.
Similarily, just before Turnus and Ev went on a vision quest a couple hours ago, I stopped by the wolverine spirit in the collegium to let her know what we were doing. The result was an epic vision quest done with the admin, completely off the cuff, with no other prep, that turned into an amazing piece of RP.
Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"
Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.
Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
Hmm I don't really hang around the forums as much nowadays but I happened to come across this thread. It's quite funny actually, yesterday I just had a conversation with someone on how the current population shift is currently happening (Less Magnagora/Glomdoring presence, more Celest/Hallifax presence), the past two-three times I've logged on there has been some good group skirmishes and some conflict rolling around, I performed a ritual to Fain in the Temple, preached about Fain to some noobs who were asking about him, some good ol' fashioned Nihilist type priestly undoings with the guildies, and here I am thinking the game is pretty rich at the moment. When I'm not hanging around forums I really am unaware of the "Lack of things" being claimed that is happening, like conflict is dead, conflict is dying, Rp is dead, Rp is dying, etc. Sure there will be down times because we all don't live in the same time zone and all can't play at the same time. Basically all I'm trying to say I think is;
Conflict and Rp are both alive and well, you just need to go look for it. Or, just create your own (much more fun anyways in my opinion!)
7
EveriineWise Old Swordsbird / BrontaurIndianapolis, IN, USA
Definitely much more fun to create your own!
Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"
Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.
Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
I don't expect to be best friends with everyone in the game. In fact, I
will often instigate conflict. It's character building. It can be lots
of fun. But being told oocly your rp is ridiculous not because it goes
against lore or game mechanics or history or even core beliefs...but because someone disagrees with the IC point of view taken. Well. When you are oocly critisized for roleplay, I think it's a sign that rp is slipping away, and being put in a position of needing to oocly defend character's point of view is stupid. I can handle any fire thrown Lavinya's way. She is not me. She acts and reacts differently to how I would. I expect her to have enemies and criticism, she makes bad mistakes and has poor judgement sometimes, it's bound to come back on her. But I don't think it's fair to bring these things ooc and thus personal. Because then the statement is that -I- am ridiculous for letting my character think such things in the firstplace.
I will honestly say my desire to keep on keeping on plummets in these situations. As a general community, we should be encouraging all aspects of roleplay - from posts to conversations, to sermons and rituals, to relationships...to whatever else you can think of. Even if we disagree, even if it angers our characters -it's roleplay. What we stand for as a whole dictates what standard will be set. I'll admit to being pretty upset at the moment. No one wants to play with people who think they are ridiculous both in character and out.
Be the change you want to see. Well, I want to see a game where people can both roleplay and fight without being called out for it oocly. What behaviour do we put up with? Because that's the standard we set. I won't put up with this, not anymore.
I don't necessarily see it as a sign that "roleplay is slipping away"; people used to use that argument against Glomdoring all the time on an OOC level (you aren't allowed to roleplay that you are not tainted, etc). It is something that has existed in Lusternia for a very, very long time and roleplay exists / thrives despite it. It's simply a matter of not being cowed by the OOC criticism and continuing to follow your roleplay (because, let's face it, people are going to criticize things that they disagree with).
I don't necessarily see it as a sign that "roleplay is slipping away"; people used to use that argument against Glomdoring all the time on an OOC level (you aren't allowed to roleplay that you are not tainted, etc). It is something that has existed in Lusternia for a very, very long time and roleplay exists / thrives despite it. It's simply a matter of not being cowed by the OOC criticism and continuing to follow your roleplay (because, let's face it, people are going to criticize things that they disagree with).
But Glomdoring does have very stern thoughts that they aren't tainted, and there is a point to that accusation it makes roleplay more limiting, just as they do not like kephera, Serenwilde forces illithoid to reincarnate and Celest doesn't like illithoid and viscanti, along with Magnagora not liking merians, kephera and elfen, etcetera.
Perhaps we just have to ask ourselves, where does restricting roleplay end and where does 'encouragement of roleplay' start. Is it possible to play a conflicted soul who goes 'I feel the forest is tainted, and yet I'm wrong. DRAMA'? Because if you want to play kephera in Glomdoring, there is a lot of railroading rp needed to 'shed the racism' as it were. Probably someone with more experience should tackle this, but yeah. It deserve some thought.
Glomdoring is at war with the Kepheran nation, and given Kepheran racial identity (that of a hive mentality)... well, some racism is to be expected.
Restricting roleplay on an in-character level is perfectly fine too, because it is completely within an organization's style to "hate" certain things and want to weed them out / burn them to the ground. That doesn't make it a "good" thing on an OOC level, but that's (again) the beauty of roleplay. It does not need to be "morally good" on an OOC level.
We're supposed to be tainted?! It seems so normal to deny that, based on everything my character has been told... which I see as the point of roleplay, and the primary appeal of these games: The players control a huge part of the direction it takes, regardless of the history/lore. In my observations, if a particular "defined role" is being ignored by the players, it's either because it was never explained very well, or it isn't very compelling. Either way, it's probably time for a change.
In-character disagreements about certain concepts is inevitable, and part of what makes it interesting. I'm sometimes disappointed by the way a particular situation works out for my character, but it's hard to understand OOC anger or judgment about the way someone else plays a game.
...Though it does happen, and will continue forever. Haters gonna hate.
"Chairwoman," Princess Setisoki states, holding up a hand in a gesture for her to stop and returning the cup. "That would be quite inappropriate. One of the males will serve me."
Comments
If you come at me seriously and I have the time, we'll have a conversation. Most of the time between other PK centered people it ends up becoming an insult contest. But I do actually play my character, with IG family/guild/and or anyone else that cares.
I just don't have the motivation to actively go out and poke random people for RP, it's not where I get the butter for my buns.
"But paradise is locked and bolted...
We must make a journey around the world
to see if a back door has perhaps been left open."
-Heinrich Von Kleist, "On the Puppet Theater"
1) My apologies to anyone reading my initial post that felt insulted/disgusted with my comments. It was wrong of me to word it the way I did and will take the time to learn from all this. I have apologized to a couple of people via pm. I am sorry for any distress or bad feelings caused.
2) I do hope that the conversation/discussion continues in the positive track. Some of you wrote some great ideas that I will be sitting down and thinking about. Thank you very much for your advice.
3) To @Lerad, my apologies for making improper assumptions. I find your writing is difficult to follow. Having this discussion while talking, I could stop you and ask for you to clarify certain points. I cannot do that effectively with posting. I will probably go back and read them again in order to play out the arguments in my head.
4) Yes, my frustrations (and cause for posting) comes from seeing certain players make fundamental changes to my roleplaying world. They have every right to it. But the MOST frustrating thing for me is not being able to properly roleplay (or interact to defend my ideals) because there is literally no one around when I log in.
Not being free to log in when the game (or even just your guild) is the most active can definitely put a lot of limits on what a person can do. However, that doesn't mean nothing can be done. I'm not sure if anyone has suggested it in this thread yet, but messages and letters are an entirely valid medium for IC interaction as well. If you can never get in touch with your guild in person, you can try to start a snail-mail conversation, using messages if nothing else. You won't be able to emote and perform physical RP, but conversation can still be RP (this IS a text game, afterall) and you can even start building a presence, influencing people, or even holding sermons from that. If you find yourself unable to physically defend your ideals because of time zone problems, you can consider remote correspondence with players who may be sympathetic to your opinions. Obviously, such a method will need far more consistent roleplaying - dropping the conversation when trying to roleplay in this manner can put you right back where you started. But something is better than nothing.
Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
EDIT: As to languages, I do recall playing a heavy RP mud where you could theoretically learn a language simply by listening others talk in it. That said, it would take RL months of people going at it for perfection in such a fashion, but still... it was something. The other interesting bit in that regard was the existence of accents. Like even if you were speaking say... elfen, but your character was originally created in Glomdoring, you'd be speaking with an accent that would identify you to a listener who is familiar with the Glomdoring accent as someone who comes from there. On the other hand, listening to an accent would mean that you would eventually be able to master THAT as well and pretend to be from somewhere else.
Forgiveness is the fragrance that the violet sheds on the heel that has crushed it.
Similarily, just before Turnus and Ev went on a vision quest a couple hours ago, I stopped by the wolverine spirit in the collegium to let her know what we were doing. The result was an epic vision quest done with the admin, completely off the cuff, with no other prep, that turned into an amazing piece of RP.
Hmm I don't really hang around the forums as much nowadays but I happened to come across this thread. It's quite funny actually, yesterday I just had a conversation with someone on how the current population shift is currently happening (Less Magnagora/Glomdoring presence, more Celest/Hallifax presence), the past two-three times I've logged on there has been some good group skirmishes and some conflict rolling around, I performed a ritual to Fain in the Temple, preached about Fain to some noobs who were asking about him, some good ol' fashioned Nihilist type priestly undoings with the guildies, and here I am thinking the game is pretty rich at the moment. When I'm not hanging around forums I really am unaware of the "Lack of things" being claimed that is happening, like conflict is dead, conflict is dying, Rp is dead, Rp is dying, etc. Sure there will be down times because we all don't live in the same time zone and all can't play at the same time. Basically all I'm trying to say I think is;
Conflict and Rp are both alive and well, you just need to go look for it. Or, just create your own (much more fun anyways in my opinion!)
I will honestly say my desire to keep on keeping on plummets in these situations. As a general community, we should be encouraging all aspects of roleplay - from posts to conversations, to sermons and rituals, to relationships...to whatever else you can think of. Even if we disagree, even if it angers our characters -it's roleplay. What we stand for as a whole dictates what standard will be set. I'll admit to being pretty upset at the moment. No one wants to play with people who think they are ridiculous both in character and out.
Be the change you want to see. Well, I want to see a game where people can both roleplay and fight without being called out for it oocly. What behaviour do we put up with? Because that's the standard we set. I won't put up with this, not anymore.
Restricting roleplay on an in-character level is perfectly fine too, because it is completely within an organization's style to "hate" certain things and want to weed them out / burn them to the ground. That doesn't make it a "good" thing on an OOC level, but that's (again) the beauty of roleplay. It does not need to be "morally good" on an OOC level.