Aesthetically-"good" orgs are susceptible to certain pressures that aesthetically-"evil" ones are not, I've found. This seems to apply to pretty much all IRE games-- Enorian faces it, whatever that city in Imperian is faces it, and Shallam sure as hell faced it before it got pwned by giant worms and a dragon.
Jadice, the Frost Queen says to you, "Constant vigilance."
Aesthetically-"good" orgs are susceptible to certain pressures that aesthetically-"evil" ones are not, I've found. This seems to apply to pretty much all IRE games-- Enorian faces it, whatever that city in Imperian is faces it, and Shallam sure as hell faced it before it got pwned by giant worms and a dragon.
Conversely, "evil" orgs are more likely to become havens for griefers and overall shitheads. They're equal and opposite forces of destruction - griefing and mudsex
We have not had any God direction for a long time, who are really the RP leaders of this game, and the Celest players have not prioritized RP in some time.
I don't think Mag has ever really had a God being the RP direction of the city. If you are relying on a God to be the focal point of your RP, I think you are doing it wrong, and will end up disappointed. The best roleplayers in Mag, the ones that are still talked about today, are Nariah, Sthai and Aiakon, and they all still have an impact on their guilds today, with player created lore and stories that have been passed down over the years.
They didn't go out and get sanctioned by a Patron, they created their own lore, roleplayed it to their own means, and eventually people started picking it up and going along with it.
2014/04/19 01:38:01 - Leolamins drained 2000000 power to raise Silvanus as a Vernal Ascendant.
2014/07/23 05:01:29 - Silvanus drained 2000000 power to raise Munsia as a Vernal Ascendant.
2015/05/24 06:03:07 - Silvanus drained 2000000 power to raise Arimisia as a Vernal Ascendant.
2015/05/24 06:03:58 - Silvanus drained 2000000 power to raise Lavinya as a Vernal Ascendant.
I wouldn't say "shattered", it's just the general ebb and flow of org activity. Celest has been pretty lawless for a while, with a generally lax and disengaged Council and little to no Divine involvement over the better course of the past year, probably longer. I'd really attribute a lot of pain to the loss of Eventru and temporarily Terentia. Despite whatever criticism there may be, Eventru was one of the cornerstones of Celest. So this past summer really felt like a kick in the teeth in the moment, when we had no Gods for a month or two. In the aftermath, long outstanding players lost the source of their character's identity, and others lost cults and similar investments that was a tangible loss to the player. Personally I am still miffed that I had to rebuild my cult off of my own essence and on my own time, and that pales in comparison to how I originally felt at the thought of losing Terentia. So we lost a lot of players in that and it hasn't really been the same since.
We have not had any God direction for a long time, who are really the RP leaders of this game, and the Celest players have not prioritized RP in some time.
I don't think Mag has ever really had a God being the RP direction of the city. If you are relying on a God to be the focal point of your RP, I think you are doing it wrong, and will end up disappointed. The best roleplayers in Mag, the ones that are still talked about today, are Nariah, Sthai and Aiakon, and they all still have an impact on their guilds today, with player created lore and stories that have been passed down over the years.
They didn't go out and get sanctioned by a Patron, they created their own lore, roleplayed it to their own means, and eventually people started picking it up and going along with it.
Fully agree, hence the second half of that sentence regarding player involvement. No one has assumed that mantle, but again, I wouldn't expect that of or demand it from a player. From a character standpoint, you might expect it from your guild and org leaders but, we all know how it goes down where people take up positions without really being leaders.
What Kelly said. Celest has been suffering badly from Star Council and especially ministry apathy for a while. We've had a terrible time trying to keep Culture Ministers around, and finding good Library aides is like looking for needles in a haystack.
For what it is worth, I have made numerous alts in almost every one of the cities/communes in the last few days just to see if I was missing out on anything that I wasn't getting in Glomdoring. The short and most a appropriate answer is certainly not. This has resulted in immediate suicide within the first hour of play.
I am not sure if people in Celest and to a lesser extent Serenwilde think that because you play in an all round "good" org you should make an effort to act like a snuggly, but that certainly shouldn't be the case. In fact, with some organisations such as those members of the Celestines I would be expecting far more appropriate behavior than bouncing up and down on the spot and other such cringe worthy emotes. It makes me think that these type of people are dragging down Lusternia, demoting it from a RP-orientated game to a social chat room for teenagers.
I am by no means anywhere near as experienced as some of you and indeed I have only dabbled in roleplay within the Harbingers and Glomdoring but if it arises I'll certainly jump at the opportunity to engage in it. Even if I am not actively in the mindframe to roleplay, I'll still go as far as tagging emotes onto my says and dish out some atmospheric emotes.
Some people might think all I have done is influence/bash since I stepped through the portal, and yes you are correct, I have. That is mostly down to my own ambitions to get involved in the endgame more than anything else and lord knows to do that you have to spend a -lot- of time doing it! Although if I was ever approached to roleplay directly or inadvertently you could count on me. I personally try my best not to AFK in places that are busy such as the nexus or aetherplex or any some such because I feel that is just being rude and is also quite frankly immersion breaking if you ask someone something and they don't reply in a timely manner.
I'd like to give a shout out to anyone in Glomdoring or Magnagora looking for some good roleplay, you'll certainly find some there if you look for it. Even if you aren't looking for it specifically, you'll find that there is always a constant aura or atmosphere that is brimming with potential for it.
I hope this post made sense, I am tired sadly
I can attest to this!
Viravain, Lady of the Thorns shouts, "And You would seize Me? Fool! I am the Glomdoring! I am the Wyrd, and beneath the cloak of Night, the shadows of the Silent stir!"
Here's the thing about culture and such too... most people simply don't want to do it. They very rarely want to RP, so those of us who do quickly give up.
I will admit though, my best RP has always been with Lyreth, @Telperion, @Terentia and with my IG family. To name a few, Jinx, Andala, @Kelly as well in their former years.
Losing Lyreth, Eventru, and Terentia has had a huge impact on my character and the way I RP as well as the city. Aeral was a snuggly, bouncy thing in her younger years but has become a quiet Terentian follower. I do my own thing because it makes me happy and that means not making any attempts to RP with really anyone any more. I've gotten to the point where if I don't find it fun, I won't do it. However, I'm sure I'm not the only one who would say no to someone approaching me with questions and such and interacting. I love putting my RP hat on if anyone engages with me directly.
Now let's address your concerns.
1) Not a whole lot we can do about it. They do it in the privacy of a manse? Fine. They do it in the city? Okay, I'll get the beating stick out. But this happens in literally every org. Sorry.
2) Yeah, Daebach is our problem. Caerlyr isn't. I'd more than agree that "zerg" is a completely OOC term that I don't want to see.
Have you honestly ever interacted with Saoirse or Ayi? Maybe I'm lucky because they're my family, because we have a fair amount of RP go on on our family channel.
The Aquamancers have their Water Rite, and I can certainly drag out the old sermons if that's what you want.
3) Actually, none of my social interaction takes place in OOC clans aside from with people from other orgs.
Also, as far as I've seen you're the exact same way that you're describing not liking people to act.
I really don't think public humilation is the best way to go about rebuilding a struggling org. Naming and shaming people like Kelly or Saorise really isn't going to accomplish much but foster negative feelings. People don't listen to constructive criticism if you start it with "This is why I think you suck..."
My moral compass doesn't exactly point due North, so if I'm questioning it, you know something might be wrong here.
As for PKers and their occasional OOCness, I think it's just something you have to learn to deal with. I try really, really hard to not let random OOC phrases seep into my characters interactions. However, you have to remember that PKers are generally here to PK, not be paragons of RP. They just want to melt your face. They stare at and write code all day and their screens are often full of highlights and system side echoes that aren't exactly IC (namely because it's code for their system.) I mean, if the worst thing you're hearing from PKers is "zerg" and "silly bitch," count your blessings and move on.
RP isn't as easy as some people make it seem (i.e. Tacita), which is something I have to keep in mind when interacting with others and something I hope people keep in mind when they interact with me. Sometimes it can take ages to flush out your character's sustainable RP that you can enjoy all the time. I played Celina for years and years before I found the SD/Princess of Darkness RP that I enjoy playing up. Once I found the niche, things just fell in to place and RP become SO MUCH EASIER. So give people a little leeway. You don't know where they are in their character development. Instead of naming and shaming them, interact with them to help them flush out their story.
Except for the frolicking mudsexers. Burn them at the stake.
I'm not going to post defending anything because if I'm honest I don't feel the need to defend myself - I shouldn't have too.
The tahto - it was created when I first joined the Tahtetso and artier when I become Champion. I'm not going to waste 850 credits to please your RP..
Secondly if I'm honest I log in to have fun, speak to a few people that I get on with and I do keep my RP to a minimum because I got bored of it if I'm honest. I have more fun fighting, killing and even dying than I do rp'ing with most people.
I'm not going to post defending anything because if I'm honest I don't feel the need to defend myself - I shouldn't have too.
The tahto - it was created when I first joined the Tahtetso and artier when I become Champion. I'm not going to waste 850 credits to please your RP..
Secondly if I'm honest I log in to have fun, speak to a few people that I get on with and I do keep my RP to a minimum because I got bored of it if I'm honest. I have more fun fighting, killing and even dying than I do rp'ing with most people.
You realize you just said you weren't going to post to defend anything, then defended yourself?
Looks more to me like he said 'those points that you say are bad about me, they're bad on purpose because I hate doing them', which isn't really a defence
So, like, I want to reiterate that I'm sorry for criticising everyone -- that's not gonna help the issues, which I think have been ironed out fairly well already. (I'm also a firm believer of not editing posts to remove all the bad stuff, like it never happened. If you guys got your feelings hurt, you can bring it up to me personally). And I think I've got y'all thinking more about RP, and hopefully more focus and love will be thrown onto Meliana and her plans without burning her out as a good solution.
Aeral:
1). I'm not out to shame mudsexers, I'm more out to shame that group of people that generally roleplay as self-entitled, lazy and are unable to use good grammar or stay, you know, IC and at the keyboard.
2). If you think Caerlyr isn't the whole alliance's problem, and that OOC/IC blurring isn't a problem, I think you need to look a little closer into this.
Yes, I do get to roleplay with Ayi sometimes, but she is quite busy most of the time. She is nothing but sweet, and I appreciate the heck out of that. To call back to my gigglemonsters comment -- they're fine. It's just when they're the only things happening, it gets a little irritating at times.
Pull out whatever sermons and ceremonies you want, but don't do it on my behalf. Do it for Celest! rally.gif
3). Good! I wonder how many other people can say the same. Not that OOC channels are a bad thing, I just think they're a little more overused in Celest than anywhere else.
I'm sorry you get that vibe from me. I've tried interacting with you because hey, another black-furred aslaran, but not much comes of it.
EDIT: Also, being really snooty on the CT after greeting you, DCing with truedeaf up and forgetting to myrtle myself is really not going to get me to want to roleplay with you, or really be in contact with you, Magister.
I don't like having to explain why Saoirse bounces, and it pains me to have to defend Saoirse's behaviour and personality because, obviously, you'd have to RP with her to understand why she does (isn't that the purpose of roleplay?). But because I don't want her to be branded as a 'gigglemonster' or a useless 'snuggly' person who just 'bounces' everywhere, I guess I'll have to explain at least some of it.
Saoirse's 'bouncing' stems from my tendency to find the urge to type even when I'm not doing anything, just reading the screen in one room or not doing anything specific to Saoirse's duties in the game. Sometimes I just find myself typing bw,cwho,gwho,sc for no reason. I guess it's a Lusternia addict thing. I JUST HAVE TO FREAKING TYPE. TAPPITY TAPPITY TAP TAP BWAH else Saoirse QUITS and I return to my social life! Aside from those, it's my way of letting people know I'm still attentive and the emote that I found compatible to Saoirse's personality is bouncing.
Saoirse bounces because she has a short attention span. She -CAN'T- sit still, she has to be out and about and doing something. If she's not working on guild projects, she's probably taking someone hunting, teaching someone, helping with domoths/fights/raids, doing a quest, planning events with her grandmother/Kelly. She doesn't like being hugged/embraced/touched/poked by anyone she doesn't seem worthy aka people she doesn't know/are not comfortable with. Heck she demands accomplishments and improvements from her own children before she even shows her affection towards them. If you hug her and she doesn't know you, I don't want to have to type a huge emote paragraph showing how much I don't/do like you, she just sends you a tell asking you what you want from her and if it's a hug, you'll promptly be replied with an "I'm sorry but I am not comfortable with that." (Can't tell you how many times people have hugged my character and demanded for a hug back, seriously gtfo mudsexers).
However, Saoirse knows when to bounce and when not to. If you find people bouncing like she does, I take it as a sign of Saoirse's infectious energy.
If you do find her idle in a place somewhere and her responses are delayed, she has probably found you too boring, or she's being flooded with multiple tells/messages, or her mind has wandered off into doing productive things for the guild (because she's GA, honestly she could be updating projects in the background).
As most people have said already, you can't expect people to roleplay for you, you have to seek it out and interact with people. I don't, however, understand how Kelly could be 'detached'. She's our org leader, she's visible, she's at the forefront of mostly everything that happens in the city. If you haven't seen her interacting with anyone, perhaps you're the one who isn't participating at all. Honestly, Saoirse has never even talked/interacted with Naraj. If you find her personality too annoying, don't worry! I'll have her avoid your character as best as she can. Saoirse's free, cheerful and positive spirit can't be held back and she doesn't have to conform to everyone else's views on how to behave.
you guys don't need to explain yourself to me. This isn't a discussion about Maligorn's Perfect New Celest and What Maligorn Wants.
I just wanted to outline some things that I think you guys need to work on, even a little, for newbie retention. Newbies mean more RP, more RP breeds more RP, more newbies come that are interested in combat, bingo Celest starts shining again. At least, in my poor troubled head, that's how it works.
Viravain, Lady of the Thorns shouts, "And You would seize Me? Fool! I am the Glomdoring! I am the Wyrd, and beneath the cloak of Night, the shadows of the Silent stir!"
Celest doesn't need intervention from anyone looking down on it and pointing out the flaws. Celest needs people who are willing to recognize the shortcomings and work towards bettering them. You're certainly entitled to your own opinion, it just happens to be largely uninformed and skewed to those who have played in Celest for years. And, the people you've called out are not necessarily explaining themselves to you, but rather to anyone who reads ill of the perception you have created. Or, maybe they're just pointing out how they disagree with you. Either way, certainly not trying to appease you or Maligorn's Perfect New Celest!
I'm glad my opinion is largely uninformed and skewed, because that's how a newbie with a clue's PoV is going to be like.
I'm going to bow out for tonight because I'm feeling a lot of needless hostility. I hope you all get the real gist of what I was trying to say, and understand that this post wasn't about throwing all of you under the bus. I'm sorry.
EDIT: Also, being really snooty on the CT after greeting you, DCing with truedeaf up and forgetting to myrtle myself is really not going to get me to want to roleplay with you, or really be in contact with you, Magister.
You asked for roleplay, and that's Aeral.
On a side note, you come in here and personally attack pretty much every name in Celest and then leave because of "needless" hostility? Please.
The whole tone here would unsurprisingly put anyone on the defensive. However, it's never a bad thing to stop and take stock (for everyone) - am I fostering an environment that encourages new people to join in with my org? Do I bother to interact with anyone outside my little circle of friends? Do I only chat on ooc clans? Do I even care if new people are drifting away because they feel excluded?
No one expects anyone to spend all their time doing things they don't enjoy, it's a game, but it never hurts to be willing to expand your attention. You don't have to love rp or spend your whole time rping to do that. If bashing is your thing, maybe you can invite smaller people on hunts? If pk is your thing, maybe you can offer up spars/arena events/training/lead people raiding? There are lots of options to keep building orgs and keep them alive that isn't too infringing on anyone's fun.
I can't stress enough how sermons/rituals/discussions etc are awesome for keeping lore alive and teaching your beliefs to all the new people (alts and newbies alike) that come into your org, not to mention they are a great opportunity for people to interact and engage with one another. So knowing Celest is reviving that sort of thing is awesome.
maligorn: I tried celest and it wasn't what I hoped for.
Older Celestian players who used to be in charge: we're sorry! hang out with us and we'll show you the coolness!
Celest players who are now in charge: this is how we like it! Who cares if you like us or not!
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
Summoning Care Bears: [][][][][][------------------
Viravain, Lady of the Thorns shouts, "And You would seize Me? Fool! I am the Glomdoring! I am the Wyrd, and beneath the cloak of Night, the shadows of the Silent stir!"
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
I really, fail to see what you mean. New Celest has role play, I mean it's not /that/ bad. Personally I like Ayi and @Saoirse because they may be slightly annoying with their personality but they are this great word, THOROUGH! Every player should -strive- to be as consistent as I have seen these two be. Then, no one would cry out for a lack of rp
so yeah if I'm unresponsive in game drop me a message here.... chances are I'm browsing
-1
Cyndarinused Flamethrower! It was super effective.
I really don't think public humilation is the best way to go about rebuilding a struggling org. Naming and shaming people like Kelly or Saorise really isn't going to accomplish much but foster negative feelings. People don't listen to constructive criticism if you start it with "This is why I think you suck..."
My moral compass doesn't exactly point due North, so if I'm questioning it, you know something might be wrong here.
As for PKers and their occasional OOCness, I think it's just something you have to learn to deal with. I try really, really hard to not let random OOC phrases seep into my characters interactions. However, you have to remember that PKers are generally here to PK, not be paragons of RP. They just want to melt your face. They stare at and write code all day and their screens are often full of highlights and system side echoes that aren't exactly IC (namely because it's code for their system.) I mean, if the worst thing you're hearing from PKers is "zerg" and "silly bitch," count your blessings and move on.
RP isn't as easy as some people make it seem (i.e. Tacita), which is something I have to keep in mind when interacting with others and something I hope people keep in mind when they interact with me. Sometimes it can take ages to flush out your character's sustainable RP that you can enjoy all the time. I played Celina for years and years before I found the SD/Princess of Darkness RP that I enjoy playing up. Once I found the niche, things just fell in to place and RP become SO MUCH EASIER. So give people a little leeway. You don't know where they are in their character development. Instead of naming and shaming them, interact with them to help them flush out their story.
Except for the frolicking mudsexers. Burn them at the stake.
It's Saoirse.....
Let's be honest, the fact that I attempted to spell it is a small miracle. I can't be bothered.
0
Cyndarinused Flamethrower! It was super effective.
Aesthetically-"good" orgs are susceptible to certain pressures that aesthetically-"evil" ones are not, I've found. This seems to apply to pretty much all IRE games-- Enorian faces it, whatever that city in Imperian is faces it, and Shallam sure as hell faced it before it got pwned by giant worms and a dragon.
Conversely, "evil" orgs are more likely to become havens for griefers and overall shitheads. They're equal and opposite forces of destruction - griefing and mudsex
This is has been disproven a million times over in Lusternia. Griefers and shitheads can be found in abundance everywhere. In fact, the game's most notorious griefer was not in an "evil" org.
FYI: Mag definitely had a god RP directing the city for a very long time. Not coincidentally, that time was also Mag's most successful and dominating. Even among the names your mentioned, both Sthai and Aiakon were heavily influenced by Fain.
Comments
I don't think Mag has ever really had a God being the RP direction of the city. If you are relying on a God to be the focal point of your RP, I think you are doing it wrong, and will end up disappointed. The best roleplayers in Mag, the ones that are still talked about today, are Nariah, Sthai and Aiakon, and they all still have an impact on their guilds today, with player created lore and stories that have been passed down over the years.
They didn't go out and get sanctioned by a Patron, they created their own lore, roleplayed it to their own means, and eventually people started picking it up and going along with it.
The Aquamancers have their Water Rite, and I can certainly drag out the old sermons if that's what you want.
Aeral:
1). I'm not out to shame mudsexers, I'm more out to shame that group of people that generally roleplay as self-entitled, lazy and are unable to use good grammar or stay, you know, IC and at the keyboard.
2). If you think Caerlyr isn't the whole alliance's problem, and that OOC/IC blurring isn't a problem, I think you need to look a little closer into this.
Yes, I do get to roleplay with Ayi sometimes, but she is quite busy most of the time. She is nothing but sweet, and I appreciate the heck out of that. To call back to my gigglemonsters comment -- they're fine. It's just when they're the only things happening, it gets a little irritating at times.
Pull out whatever sermons and ceremonies you want, but don't do it on my behalf. Do it for Celest! rally.gif
3). Good! I wonder how many other people can say the same. Not that OOC channels are a bad thing, I just think they're a little more overused in Celest than anywhere else.
I'm sorry you get that vibe from me. I've tried interacting with you because hey, another black-furred aslaran, but not much comes of it.
EDIT: Also, being really snooty on the CT after greeting you, DCing with truedeaf up and forgetting to myrtle myself is really not going to get me to want to roleplay with you, or really be in contact with you, Magister.
Saoirse's 'bouncing' stems from my tendency to find the urge to type even when I'm not doing anything, just reading the screen in one room or not doing anything specific to Saoirse's duties in the game. Sometimes I just find myself typing bw,cwho,gwho,sc for no reason. I guess it's a Lusternia addict thing. I JUST HAVE TO FREAKING TYPE. TAPPITY TAPPITY TAP TAP BWAH else Saoirse QUITS and I return to my social life! Aside from those, it's my way of letting people know I'm still attentive and the emote that I found compatible to Saoirse's personality is bouncing.
Saoirse bounces because she has a short attention span. She -CAN'T- sit still, she has to be out and about and doing something. If she's not working on guild projects, she's probably taking someone hunting, teaching someone, helping with domoths/fights/raids, doing a quest, planning events with her grandmother/Kelly. She doesn't like being hugged/embraced/touched/poked by anyone she doesn't seem worthy aka people she doesn't know/are not comfortable with. Heck she demands accomplishments and improvements from her own children before she even shows her affection towards them. If you hug her and she doesn't know you, I don't want to have to type a huge emote paragraph showing how much I don't/do like you, she just sends you a tell asking you what you want from her and if it's a hug, you'll promptly be replied with an "I'm sorry but I am not comfortable with that." (Can't tell you how many times people have hugged my character and demanded for a hug back, seriously gtfo mudsexers).
However, Saoirse knows when to bounce and when not to. If you find people bouncing like she does, I take it as a sign of Saoirse's infectious energy.
If you do find her idle in a place somewhere and her responses are delayed, she has probably found you too boring, or she's being flooded with multiple tells/messages, or her mind has wandered off into doing productive things for the guild (because she's GA, honestly she could be updating projects in the background).
As most people have said already, you can't expect people to roleplay for you, you have to seek it out and interact with people. I don't, however, understand how Kelly could be 'detached'. She's our org leader, she's visible, she's at the forefront of mostly everything that happens in the city. If you haven't seen her interacting with anyone, perhaps you're the one who isn't participating at all. Honestly, Saoirse has never even talked/interacted with Naraj. If you find her personality too annoying, don't worry! I'll have her avoid your character as best as she can. Saoirse's free, cheerful and positive spirit can't be held back and she doesn't have to conform to everyone else's views on how to behave.
you guys don't need to explain yourself to me. This isn't a discussion about Maligorn's Perfect New Celest and What Maligorn Wants.
I just wanted to outline some things that I think you guys need to work on, even a little, for newbie retention. Newbies mean more RP, more RP breeds more RP, more newbies come that are interested in combat, bingo Celest starts shining again. At least, in my poor troubled head, that's how it works.
I'm going to bow out for tonight because I'm feeling a lot of needless hostility. I hope you all get the real gist of what I was trying to say, and understand that this post wasn't about throwing all of you under the bus. I'm sorry.
The whole tone here would unsurprisingly put anyone on the defensive. However, it's never a bad thing to stop and take stock (for everyone) - am I fostering an environment that encourages new people to join in with my org? Do I bother to interact with anyone outside my little circle of friends? Do I only chat on ooc clans? Do I even care if new people are drifting away because they feel excluded?
No one expects anyone to spend all their time doing things they don't enjoy, it's a game, but it never hurts to be willing to expand your attention. You don't have to love rp or spend your whole time rping to do that. If bashing is your thing, maybe you can invite smaller people on hunts? If pk is your thing, maybe you can offer up spars/arena events/training/lead people raiding? There are lots of options to keep building orgs and keep them alive that isn't too infringing on anyone's fun.
I can't stress enough how sermons/rituals/discussions etc are awesome for keeping lore alive and teaching your beliefs to all the new people (alts and newbies alike) that come into your org, not to mention they are a great opportunity for people to interact and engage with one another. So knowing Celest is reviving that sort of thing is awesome.
maligorn: I tried celest and it wasn't what I hoped for.
Older Celestian players who used to be in charge: we're sorry! hang out with us and we'll show you the coolness!
Celest players who are now in charge: this is how we like it! Who cares if you like us or not!
Summoning Care Bears:
[][][][][][------------------
Everyone duck and cover!
Let's be honest, the fact that I attempted to spell it is a small miracle. I can't be bothered.
This is has been disproven a million times over in Lusternia. Griefers and shitheads can be found in abundance everywhere. In fact, the game's most notorious griefer was not in an "evil" org.
FYI: Mag definitely had a god RP directing the city for a very long time. Not coincidentally, that time was also Mag's most successful and dominating. Even among the names your mentioned, both Sthai and Aiakon were heavily influenced by Fain.