A free 400 damage boost to pvp is quite big. Though I've not played around much with the Dracnari/Taurian ones, so I'm not sure how comparable they are. I am a bit uncomfortable with it, though I'm not sure how big of a difference it makes. Maybe if we tone it down (like make it a pittance of damage, maybe 100 or less?), and make it a little more flavourful (messages that indicate it changes the nature of the attack, rather than just be a flat additional punch or hit on top of it) it might be worth keeping as a PVP fluff thing.
I think it's fine for it to continue to affect PVE as-is, it's not like it's a full extra hit (I think, not sure how the numbers translate to PVE) - it's not like we don't kill stuff fast anyway, the extra bit won't make it that much faster.
One more thought: Pricing dingbat items at 1:1 credit:dingbat ratio only works if you sell them at a 1:1 ratio. Just because we currently trade them at that rate in-game doesn't mean that they are the same, the only thing it means is that people can do more with credits and don't have as much need with dingbats. Lower supply, but lower demand, leaves them being roughly the same. Increasing the demand of one and keeping the supply artificially low impacts the trade rate that you're comparing to, instead of the one that you actually control (and the one you control is the one you should be looking at).
But yes, I fully agree with the other design people above. It doesn't matter to me whether they are designed by gnomes or not. If I can't see my character wearing it as their armour replacement, my character will not wear it as armour replacement (and I'm not about to buy it to just... not wear it :P ). The gnome selling them is theoretically a designer extraordinaire, just because they are a gnome doesn't mean that they can't market / sell designs aimed at their audience. I mean, there are RL designers who create all kinds of stuff that they'd never wear themselves but is aimed at a group of people who adore their work.
A free 400 damage boost to pvp is quite big. Though I've not played around much with the Dracnari/Taurian ones, so I'm not sure how comparable they are. I am a bit uncomfortable with it, though I'm not sure how big of a difference it makes. Maybe if we tone it down (like make it a pittance of damage, maybe 100 or less?), and make it a little more flavourful (messages that indicate it changes the nature of the attack, rather than just be a flat additional punch or hit on top of it) it might be worth keeping as a PVP fluff thing.
I think it's fine for it to continue to affect PVE as-is, it's not like it's a full extra hit (I think, not sure how the numbers translate to PVE) - it's not like we don't kill stuff fast anyway, the extra bit won't make it that much faster.
It makes a big difference. I want to check that the proc rates are intended, but its pretty big in terms of percent added.
Thoughts of a high-level newbie: I read "Aethersuits" and a little bit of pee came out as I imagined by bipedal genderbending treedude travelling through aether space with naught but a carapace of Wyrd-infused organic armour separating him from the endless void. "This is the stuff Bardics are made of!" I yelled, much to go the startlement of my wife who is normal enough to have no clue what Lusternia is. Then I read about them, and pee gave way to tears. I sent a wtf tell to somebody asking them if I was correctly reading about rocket-propelled steammech armour with shoulder cannons being injected into this low-tech fantasy crossover, and they wtf's me back and told me to lrn2lore. So I conceded that steam and cannons are canon, but was still left with the thought of Versaleanm who claims to be Glomdoring itself - putting on a mech armour suit and it didn't work. Then I saw the price tag and realised that Aethersuits will never affect me. Finally, I'll add my disagreement with the 1:1 ratio. I've bought and sold dingbats at 2:1 at times that there was far less demand for them than these suits have the potential to create. I wouldn't be surprised to see 3:1 happening given the boards of credits folks are sitting on with nothing to spend them on. I'll be blunt, I already feel as if I've run out of things to spend credits on, so it's nice to have something to save for. These suits are a really great idea at core, but they want tweaking. Throw in a few goopskins, take another look at the dingbat promo, and you'll shift units of these things. Mad propz.
bipedal genderbending treedude travelling through aether space with naught but a carapace of Wyrd-infused organic armour separating him from the endless void. "This is the stuff Bardics are made of!"
!!!
I'm on it. TO WORD!
The purpose of writing is to inflate weak ideas, obscure pure reasoning, and inhibit clarity. With a little practice, writing can be an intimidating and impenetrable fog!
Yeah, sounds boss. I've always thought some kind of (non-gigeresque for Seren) bio'tech' type stuff for the communes would be awesome, bondleaf wrap or beetle buckler style.
Biotech would definitely be way more appealing, and keep the "tech" theme that is desired. Just not the same style of tech. I am not anti tech in Lusternia (I do use aetherships), but am interested in a more organic form of it. Ilosia is a giant flying spidership, for example, not a ticking clock. It is far more appropriate for Communes (and probably Gaudiguch too).
Edit: If someone wants to put together some design ideas for that sort of thing, it has already been kind-of-encouraged!
They do a little under half the amount that Dracnari's racial power does, but trigger a little over twice as often. [Note: this is how they are now, which is slightly tweaked down from where they were at release]
When it says no runes, does this include the artifact runes (damage/resistance/etc) that can go on armor or is just the forging runes?
This is just talking about the Great Rune of the Master Armourer, which increases the knot slots available. This function is available through the built-in power up.
Assuming that you don't have the master module installed, what type of armor is the suit equivalent o? Basic plate? Basic robes? None?
Edit: Does the aethercommerce bonus stack with the one you get from completing the aetherepic?
The aethersuits are equivalent to either normal robes (if you have acrobatics) or plate armour if not. If you have Splendours in Tailoring or MasterArmour in Forging, you can purchase the Master upgrade for the suit which will convert them to splendour robe stats (if you have acrobatics) or masterarmour stats.
So I'm wearing a robe with great runes. I'm also wearing an aethersuit. Do they stack in any way? Does one fully override the other? Do I get the best of both?
They do not stack. It's likely the one with the lower item # is the one that will take precedence, but I'm not certain. There's no code that will ensure you get the best benefit from both pieces.
Okay, I hear you guys concerning aethersuits. I'm wondering--and I'm not sure if we can or will do this, but I just wanted the float the idea--what if Tink sold gears that acted like runes (i.e., invisible when you put them on armour) that mimicked some of the powers of the aethersuits?
Assuming that you don't have the master module installed, what type of armor is the suit equivalent o? Basic plate? Basic robes? None?
Edit: Does the aethercommerce bonus stack with the one you get from completing the aetherepic?
The aethersuits are equivalent to either normal robes (if you have acrobatics) or plate armour if not. If you have Splendours in Tailoring or MasterArmour in Forging, you can purchase the Master upgrade for the suit which will convert them to splendour robe stats (if you have acrobatics) or masterarmour stats.
So, this makes the Master module a downgrade if you have Tailoring for Splendours as splendours is 16% vs the forged armor 20%? Or am I misunderstanding how this module works for splendours?
Okay, I hear you guys concerning aethersuits. I'm wondering--and I'm not sure if we can or will do this, but I just wanted the float the idea--what if Tink sold gears that acted like runes (i.e., invisible when you put them on armour) that mimicked some of the powers of the aethersuits?
Assuming that you don't have the master module installed, what type of armor is the suit equivalent o? Basic plate? Basic robes? None?
Edit: Does the aethercommerce bonus stack with the one you get from completing the aetherepic?
The aethersuits are equivalent to either normal robes (if you have acrobatics) or plate armour if not. If you have Splendours in Tailoring or MasterArmour in Forging, you can purchase the Master upgrade for the suit which will convert them to splendour robe stats (if you have acrobatics) or masterarmour stats.
So, if you don't have acrobatics the Master upgrade downgrades the suit?
Also, can we get confirmation on numbers for the cannon, and what type it is?
Okay, I hear you guys concerning aethersuits. I'm wondering--and I'm not sure if we can or will do this, but I just wanted the float the idea--what if Tink sold gears that acted like runes (i.e., invisible when you put them on armour) that mimicked some of the powers of the aethersuits?
This would be an acceptable option to me. I do like cool customizations and do not object to the suits in principle, but if the suits are going to remain the way they are then attachable runes are a good alternative that lets us keep our "look and feel" that is a huge part of our character to at least some of us.
If we went the rune route, it would be important to ensure that both options were more or less identical in benefit. If the 'gear' runes don't provide the full upgrade path that aethersuits do, the solution is incomplete.
@Iosai, are you able to comment on aethersuits and Kata Tattoos, tattoo armour, Tattoos TattooMaster?
Also, is there any prestige tied to the aethersuits? If they're meant to replace robes/plate (and may behave poorly when worn with either of the above), there's a fair amount of prestige lost by wearing an aethersuit versus robes/greatrobes/plate/masterplate. On the other hand, artifacts bearing a prestige stat seems like a dangerous step.
Anyway, I was thinking of having a contest where anyone can submit one design for the gnome couture, and we would pick the top ten designs. If your design is picked, we'd give you a free couture armour of that design.
I'd jump on this in a heartbeat, even if I didn't get a suit for my work. Being able to design something that ignores half the design rules, like a customized item, that others might buy and wear? Yes, please. Though, it may not be a bad idea to hand out rewarded suits in a gift box incase you designed one and won, but the suit doesn't....well, suit you. For instance, I might design a set of "bioluminescent wildwood scaffold armour" but not be a wildwood.
I'd like to also suggest that you ponder giving these suits ambiances, like whirring servos and hissing steam, but based on the suit's concept. I know we can do that ourselves through the reaction system, but I think it would add to the realism and make these suits really worth more.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
I'd like to also suggest that you ponder giving these suits ambiances, like whirring servos and hissing steam, but based on the suit's concept. I know we can do that ourselves through the reaction system, but I think it would add to the realism and make these suits really worth more.
I touched on this in my customizations thread - please no to this for me as long as I can't change it. I would rather the ambiances be done on our side.
Okay, I hear you guys concerning aethersuits. I'm wondering--and I'm not sure if we can or will do this, but I just wanted the float the idea--what if Tink sold gears that acted like runes (i.e., invisible when you put them on armour) that mimicked some of the powers of the aethersuits?
Possible issue. Right now you have to buy the 'master' module to upgrade. If you can just put gears on splendors/masterplate it would be cheaper no? Also, you might wind up with a different number of slots.
I don't personally have much of a problem with the steampunk view (made by gnomes they should look gnomish). That said, if the finks introduced a Guyver version, I'd much prefer it.
If we went the rune route, it would be important to ensure that both options were more or less identical in benefit. If the 'gear' runes don't provide the full upgrade path that aethersuits do, the solution is incomplete.
@Iosai, are you able to comment on aethersuits and Kata Tattoos, tattoo armour, Tattoos TattooMaster?
The aethersuit armour is taken into consideration before tattoos armour, effectively overriding it for the purposes of damage (read: armour) calculations. Any other effects tattoos may have will continue to take effect.
Assuming that you don't have the master module installed, what type of armor is the suit equivalent o? Basic plate? Basic robes? None?
Edit: Does the aethercommerce bonus stack with the one you get from completing the aetherepic?
The aethersuits are equivalent to either normal robes (if you have acrobatics) or plate armour if not. If you have Splendours in Tailoring or MasterArmour in Forging, you can purchase the Master upgrade for the suit which will convert them to splendour robe stats (if you have acrobatics) or masterarmour stats.
So, this makes the Master module a downgrade if you have Tailoring for Splendours as splendours is 16% vs the forged armor 20%? Or am I misunderstanding how this module works for splendours?
If you have Acrobatics: Normal aethersuit: 12% (great robes) Master aethersuit: 16% (splendour robes)
If you don't have Acrobatics: Normal aethersuit: 20% (forged armour) Master aethersuit: 25% (master armour)
This means aethersuits are iffy for monks as far as armour goes.
Monk acrobat, no tradeskills to consider: 14% armour (tattoo armour) Monk acrobat, no tradeskills to consider, in an aethersuit: 12% Monk acrobat, no tradeskills to consider, in a master aethersuit: 12%
Monk psymet, no tradeskills to consider: 20% armour (from forged armour) Monk psymet, no tradeskills to consider, in aethersuit: 20% Monk psymet, no tradeskills to consider, in a master aethersuit: 20%
Monk acrobat, trans tailoring: 16% (splendour robe) Monk acrobat, trans tailoring, in aethersuit: 12% Monk acrobat, trans tailoring, in a master aethersuit: 16%
Monk psymet, trans tailoring: 20% (from forged armour*) Monk psymet, trans tailoring, in aethersuit: 12% Monk psymet, trans tailoring, in a master aethersuit: 16%
Monk acrobat, trans tattoos: 18% (master tattoo armour) Monk acrobat, trans tattoos, in aethersuit: 12% Monk acrobat, trans tattoos, in a master aethersuit: 12%
Monk psymet, trans tattoos: 18% (master tattoo armour**) Monk psymet, trans tattoos, in aethersuit: 20% Monk psymet, trans tattoos, in a master aethersuit: 20%
*For psymet monks, forged armour is generally a better choice than even splendour robes.
** A monk psymet with trans tattoos would probably choose tattoo armour (+ leather vest) over forged armour, because of the doubling effect the Kata Tattoos ability has on damage absorption tattoos.
In short, if the monk has trans tattoos, is an acrobat without transed tailoring, or is a psymet with transed tailoring, the aethersuit reduces their defensive abilities.
Are kephera demigods (inherent splendours-level defense when not wearing armour) able to use the effects of a master aethersuit to gain splendours defenses?
Why are we paying an extra 25db to get the master bonus? Why can't it just be 'if you have the skill, here you go,' like robes and armour currently are?
Why are we paying an extra 25db to get the master bonus? Why can't it just be 'if you have the skill, here you go,' like robes and armour currently are?
Comments
I think it's fine for it to continue to affect PVE as-is, it's not like it's a full extra hit (I think, not sure how the numbers translate to PVE) - it's not like we don't kill stuff fast anyway, the extra bit won't make it that much faster.
But yes, I fully agree with the other design people above. It doesn't matter to me whether they are designed by gnomes or not. If I can't see my character wearing it as their armour replacement, my character will not wear it as armour replacement (and I'm not about to buy it to just... not wear it :P ). The gnome selling them is theoretically a designer extraordinaire, just because they are a gnome doesn't mean that they can't market / sell designs aimed at their audience. I mean, there are RL designers who create all kinds of stuff that they'd never wear themselves but is aimed at a group of people who adore their work.
I'm on it. TO WORD!
Edit: If someone wants to put together some design ideas for that sort of thing, it has already been kind-of-encouraged!
EDIT: for numbers, that appears to be ~400 damage, with ~33% chance to tick.
So, this makes the Master module a downgrade if you have Tailoring for Splendours as splendours is 16% vs the forged armor 20%? Or am I misunderstanding how this module works for splendours?
I'm a fan!
So, if you don't have acrobatics the Master upgrade downgrades the suit?Also, can we get confirmation on numbers for the cannon, and what type it is?
@Iosai, are you able to comment on aethersuits and Kata Tattoos, tattoo armour, Tattoos TattooMaster?
I'd like to also suggest that you ponder giving these suits ambiances, like whirring servos and hissing steam, but based on the suit's concept. I know we can do that ourselves through the reaction system, but I think it would add to the realism and make these suits really worth more.
I don't personally have much of a problem with the steampunk view (made by gnomes they should look gnomish). That said, if the finks introduced a Guyver version, I'd much prefer it.
Normal aethersuit: 12% (great robes)
Master aethersuit: 16% (splendour robes)
If you don't have Acrobatics:
Normal aethersuit: 20% (forged armour)
Master aethersuit: 25% (master armour)
Monk acrobat, no tradeskills to consider: 14% armour (tattoo armour)
Monk acrobat, no tradeskills to consider, in an aethersuit: 12%
Monk acrobat, no tradeskills to consider, in a master aethersuit: 12%
Monk psymet, no tradeskills to consider: 20% armour (from forged armour)
Monk psymet, no tradeskills to consider, in aethersuit: 20%
Monk psymet, no tradeskills to consider, in a master aethersuit: 20%
Monk acrobat, trans tailoring: 16% (splendour robe)
Monk acrobat, trans tailoring, in aethersuit: 12%
Monk acrobat, trans tailoring, in a master aethersuit: 16%
Monk psymet, trans tailoring: 20% (from forged armour*)
Monk psymet, trans tailoring, in aethersuit: 12%
Monk psymet, trans tailoring, in a master aethersuit: 16%
Monk acrobat, trans tattoos: 18% (master tattoo armour)
Monk acrobat, trans tattoos, in aethersuit: 12%
Monk acrobat, trans tattoos, in a master aethersuit: 12%
Monk psymet, trans tattoos: 18% (master tattoo armour**)
Monk psymet, trans tattoos, in aethersuit: 20%
Monk psymet, trans tattoos, in a master aethersuit: 20%
*For psymet monks, forged armour is generally a better choice than even splendour robes.
** A monk psymet with trans tattoos would probably choose tattoo armour (+ leather vest) over forged armour, because of the doubling effect the Kata Tattoos ability has on damage absorption tattoos.
In short, if the monk has trans tattoos, is an acrobat without transed tailoring, or is a psymet with transed tailoring, the aethersuit reduces their defensive abilities.
Are kephera demigods (inherent splendours-level defense when not wearing armour) able to use the effects of a master aethersuit to gain splendours defenses?