Fated v. Unfated

Daraius

This has come up once or twice recently and I'm not really sure if there's an answer. I see several degrees of existence in Lusternia in something of a heirarchy:

Gods (players)

Adventurers (players)

Named denizens (Lukun, Fraesic)

Unnamed denizens (comptrollers, custodians)

Thousands of implied but unseen denizens (people waiting in line in the room descriptions of the lower wards)

We know the adventurers are all fated, meaning they passed through the Portal of Fate. Are we to understand all denizens are unfated? Or just the unnamed ones? Or just the thousands of implied ones? Or is there some other way of thinking about this?

Silvanus

I would guess that all(or most) named denizens are fated as well.

In the histories, adventurers that went through the portal existed before players were ever given the chance, so there should be a number of fated individuals before players were ever around.

Another thing they mention in the histories is that the adventurers that go through the portal become great leaders and influence the course of history, and think about some of the named individuals, like Ladantine, Marilynth, Rowena.

Enyalida

I could go on about this for... a while. Short version:

Lusternia's general character 'metastory' describes an arc of Ascension, from a creature residing purely in the realm of bodies and things to a spiritual entity who can controll or shape the body, and the world around it. As characters advance, the woes of the body become less and less, and the body is more easily shaped to the will inhabiting it. In that sense, there is a distinction between denizens who are not spiritually awakened (usually kickstarted by the PoF, but ostensibly possible through just being an old badass?) and those who are. 

Daraius

Enyalida said:

I could go on about this for... a while. Short version:

Lusternia's general character 'metastory' describes an arc of Ascension, from a creature residing purely in the realm of bodies and things to a spiritual entity who can controll or shape the body, and the world around it. As characters advance, the woes of the body become less and less, and the body is more easily shaped to the will inhabiting it. In that sense, there is a distinction between denizens who are not spiritually awakened (usually kickstarted by the PoF, but ostensibly possible through just being an old badass?) and those who are. 

I wouldn't mind hearing the longer version of that, actually. It sounds really interesting but I'm not sure I quite get it from the tl;dr version!

Belibi

At the end of the Book of Meridian in the histories of the elder wars it seems to be saying that what makes someone "fated" is there being a player behind the character.

"They are quite unaware of the Other," said Clotho quietly in the Elder tongue so Mlorag wouldn't understand. "When they step through the portal, they brush against another reality, finding another soul that resonates with their own, a quantum twin."

Daraius

Yep, that's part of the confusion, because the beings they're referring to existed way before any players were around.

Siam

I look at it this way: the souls that brush up with the Lusternians who go through the Portal may not come from just one reality. Our reality may have access to Lusternia since 2008 but other realities may have access to it prior! /rp

Maellio

Mael [et I] has a theory that lines up that only Adventurers are those that are Fated, and that even the named Denizens are without an 'Other' and are the same as the unknown masses that make up the logically larger population of the Basin. 

It's more a matter of importance to the Tapestry, interest to the Fated, and a sort of drop in sentience and awareness as one does the same thing every day [and lives the same life, no matter how many times we kill them]. To sorta explain why mobs occasionally get 'possessed', its a momentary flash of importance and sentience as they break from the routines that made them automata. 

I really need to write those scrolls I don't write, yup. 

Belibi

It also implies that our lives are controlled by Others who similarly believe themselves to be playing games. So clearly multiple realities are the assumption.

Munsia

So I have a sub question, or perhaps it is the main question.

Did people die before us? Histories existing pre taint wars, did people die of battle/natural causes? Or is everyone ever immortal? How much curing was available back then? Could 100% of illnesses and things such as broken legs be cured the same way? 

Llandros

Regeneration and Allheale require sparkle berries. Astral wasn't discovered until the taint wars so they didn't have those two until sometime after then.

The histories do mention elderly people and there are various crypts and such so death and dying do seem to be possible in the days of yore.

Edit: I question the wisdom of the first person who found a berry in a nightmarish insanity inducing hellscape and said hey I think I'm going to eat that.

Munsia

Following this question, then. Is anyone aware of any battles? We know assassinations happened, but were there territory wars? Could there have been? Is there proof we lived in 100% harmony pre taint wars? 

Kalnid

Absolutely didn't, Cloudspout being the best proof to the contrary. Basically: assisted with drug-gas, the ur'guard managed to convince Gaudi to join the Celestine Empire. Tried it against Halli later, didn't work. Used it to pacify the Moors inhabitants, worked okay.

Tridemon

Certainly there were territorial wars- like the one that ended when the Serenwilde got cut in half by the Alabaster Highway.

Munsia

Can you guys point me to references either pastebins, or message me in game/send me books of all proof of conflicts pre taint war? I need proof and noone seems to have any for me. I need to know about everything from internal fighting (physical not political) to external race/territorial wars

Turnus

The whole red star lovers thing was pre taint, and the diary entry about it (it was posted to forums I think) definitely included information about how they built an army to fight against the Celestine Empire, which they ended up losing horribly.

This line is in the Taint Wars section of the Celestine Empire history: “They live in the Grey Moors too,” growled Packleader Oolit. “We have many battles with the aslaran over that land.”

It's pretty heavily implied that the Ur'guard were basically shock troopers used by the Celestine Empire to keep the peace as well.

Marcella

The Catacombs were used pretty heavy-handedly during Empire times. It's hard to revolt when you know a full battallion can be on your village's doorstep in fifteen minutes thanks to OP as hell fast travel.

Munsia

So @Llandros and Company. More along this lines

So, say someone broke a leg in the past. Pre us....pre taint war. 

Now it's been brought up that healing existed, but was it instant like it is now? 

If you broke a limb, would someone cure it instantly? What if your leg was amputated? Did diseases effect limbs ever? Was blindness ever a problem? What is the depth of injury/disease and available cures...

Should I just get my own thread? -.-

Ushaara

@Munsia

For other battles, there was the Battle of the Horns in what was now Blasted Lands. If I remember right, that involved driving loboshigaru tribes off the land or something. I think the  History of the Paladins book in the World Library, by Lusternian Historical Society has slightly more detail. Same book also mentions battles (or at least skirmishes) in the Skarch with the cult there, which was also featured in of one of those 'Do X for a month' promo miniquests with the temporally displaced people. Both these predate Taint Wars I believe.

Don't think the Burning Star Campaign original book can be acquired IG, but someone transcribed into library system I think. Could also go talk to the person in Shrine of St Loathys in southern mountains.

Ushaara

Oh, and there's also the Mag bard quest thing about the Gyeullolox Empire/Great Tyrant. Not whole lot of detail though.

Daraius

Munsia said:

Should I just get my own thread? -.-

Yes, because I get emailed every time someone posts here.  :o3

Munsia

Oh, so keep the posts here...got it