Let's go with a better example here. If I code something into our application at work which users can press to 'up-code' patients, allowing them to get higher reimbursement from the federal government, without any supporting documentation... whether I put a disclaimer on it or not, I am helping them commit fraud and I (and my company) are liable as well. Disclaimers are not get-out-of-jail-free cards. If someone is using the code as intended, the responsibility does indeed rest on the person who created and distributed it.
Apparently what needs to happen is that Iosai needs to code in a part of Lusternia code that parses your scripts and checks for crown or Saracen.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
Just to clarify further than Lerad already asserted:
Yes. the admin have given me the -full- go-ahead with these scripts. Should you choose to use them in any semblance of 'bad' manner, then fully expect to be shrubbed. It's as simple as that. With Saracen, we merely aim to attain the highest level of security and cohesiveness within Saracen, while also asserting the very highest levels of game security.
Just to clarify further than Lerad already asserted:
Yes. the admin have given me the -full- go-ahead with these scripts. Should you choose to use them in any semblance of 'bad' manner, then fully expect to be shrubbed. It's as simple as that. With Saracen, we merely aim to attain the highest level of security and security within Saracen, while also asserting the very highest levels of game security.
So your idea of "security" is to distribute a system that is illegal to use (everyone but you and Shaddus agrees on this part) right out of the box, and going "Well, if they use it and get shrubbed, it's their fault"?
Seriously, stop with the attempts at belittling with "dear" and "cupcake".
Autobashing is illegal, and have always been. Helpfiles state this, past experience state this, admins have stated this in the past. Will they stop you from distributing it? Probably not. They can't really control what systems you use, after all. That doesn't make them legal to use though, and until an admin actually steps in and saying "Autobashing is legal", then I will never see it being legal. Period.
Seriously, stop with the attempts at belittling with "dear" and "cupcake".
Autobashing is illegal, and have always been. Helpfiles state this, past experience state this, admins have stated this in the past. Will they stop you from distributing it? Probably not. They can't really control what systems you use, after all. That doesn't make them legal to use though, and until an admin actually steps in and saying "Autobashing is legal", then I will never see it being legal. Period.
I know you don't want to consider it, but you asked for input and that is mine. I feel quite strongly about the notion of personal responsibility, and that disclaimers do not absolve a person of that responsibility.
If someone uses a product in -exactly- the way it was written, there is in fact some burden on the coder for enabling it.
Especially when there is such an easy fix available that would take the responsibility entirely out of your hands. It is a problem that can be addressed with very little additional code.
No, dear. The system is -not- illegal to use, and never will be.
Ssaliss is referring specifically to the genrun autobashing part of your scripts, Draylor. It IS illegal to use them, by the rules already quoted in this thread. The rest of the system is, of course, fine. But that's not what he's referring to, and you know it as well. Arguing semantics is not going to help your case. If you want to be a jerk salesman, throw out your chest and be proud of being a jerk. Don't try to whitewash your system, which facillates abuse, as anything other than what it is. The admin have, as you claimed, already told you that you are free to be as much of an asshole as you want, selling a system that can get your customers shrubbed. So I don't see any reason why you should be ashamed.
15.8 TRIGGERS, AUTOMATION, AND AUTO (AUTORAT, AUTOBASH ETC)
Triggers and automation are allowed in most cases as long as they are not used for gaining gold or experience, whether you are AFK or not.
What is not allowed?
Auto ratting, auto weeviling, auto questing, auto bashing, auto aetherspace hunting (and auto pretty much everything else).
1) that you automate via triggers, and 2) that you use to gain gold or experience.
If you set up a system that allows your character to bash, heal and move around to the point where you can fall asleep at your keyboard (or be in another window) and your character continues to bash and gain experience, then you are setting yourself up for permanent shrubbing--because everyone with such systems (if they don't immediately AFK) eventually succumbs through laziness or complacency. We suggest you immediately disable such systems.
Automated play in any form is likely to constitute a violation of our rules. Penalties will depend on the context. In extreme cases, a violation may be punishable by shrubbing or banning.
Then quit complaining about his script and don't buy it?
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
Hey, I already said I would buy them if I didn't already have my own. I never complained about his scripts in any way. I am, however, complaining about him saying that my statement is false when it is true. The scripts are illegal to use.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
Uh huh, and I (and Ssaliss, and any number of previous posters) provided actual helpfiles proof to argue that you're wrong. Your only evidence has been your claims that the admin have told you otherwise, which you haven't actually provided in full, or even quoted. The helpfiles come from the same absolute source that you are using as your evidence: the admin. Until you provide actual evidence, that is, the text in full in which the admin contradict their own helpfile, I'm afraid to say you're not very convincing.
The scripts are illegal to use as far as we as players know. You are free to make and sell them, and even advertise your business as "customer first" (literally, the customer gets shrubbed first, haha) all you want. Using those scripts are still illegal.
Hey, I already said I would buy them if I didn't already have my own. I never complained about his scripts in any way. I am, however, complaining about him saying that my statement is false when it is true. The scripts are illegal to use.
Again, in correct, my friend. That is simply not the case.
What, Lerad? You have your own? You rule-breaker!
Sic 'em, Glomtrain.
Of course. I'm a rule breaker. I haven't been caught by the admin yet, but there are a few people who would have shrubbed me on numerous occasions if they could. Doesn't change the fact that what I was doing was cheating, nor that Draylor's selling a system that facillates said cheating.
Comments
So your idea of "security" is to distribute a system that is illegal to use (everyone but you and Shaddus agrees on this part) right out of the box, and going "Well, if they use it and get shrubbed, it's their fault"?
Autobashing is illegal, and have always been. Helpfiles state this, past experience state this, admins have stated this in the past. Will they stop you from distributing it? Probably not. They can't really control what systems you use, after all. That doesn't make them legal to use though, and until an admin actually steps in and saying "Autobashing is legal", then I will never see it being legal. Period.
If someone uses a product in -exactly- the way it was written, there is in fact some burden on the coder for enabling it.
Especially when there is such an easy fix available that would take the responsibility entirely out of your hands. It is a problem that can be addressed with very little additional code.
Triggers and automation are allowed in most cases as long as they are not used
for gaining gold or experience, whether you are AFK or not.
What is not allowed?
Auto ratting, auto weeviling, auto questing, auto bashing, auto aetherspace hunting (and auto pretty
much everything else).
1) that you automate via triggers, and
2) that you use to gain gold or experience.
Uh huh.
15.8 TRIGGERS, AUTOMATION, AND AUTO (AUTORAT, AUTOBASH ETC)
Triggers and automation are allowed in most cases as long as they are not used for gaining gold or experience, whether you are AFK or not.
What is not allowed?
Auto ratting, auto weeviling, auto questing, auto bashing, auto aetherspace hunting (and auto pretty much everything else).
1) that you automate via triggers, and
2) that you use to gain gold or experience.
If you set up a system that allows your character to bash, heal and move around to the point where you can fall asleep at your keyboard (or be in another window) and your character continues to bash and gain experience, then you are setting yourself up for permanent shrubbing--because everyone with such systems (if they don't immediately AFK) eventually succumbs through laziness or complacency. We suggest you immediately disable such systems.
Automated play in any form is likely to constitute a violation of our rules. Penalties will depend on the context. In extreme cases, a violation may be punishable by shrubbing or banning.
Sic 'em, Glomtrain.
The scripts are illegal to use as far as we as players know. You are free to make and sell them, and even advertise your business as "customer first" (literally, the customer gets shrubbed first, haha) all you want. Using those scripts are still illegal.
Of course. I'm a rule breaker. I haven't been caught by the admin yet, but there are a few people who would have shrubbed me on numerous occasions if they could. Doesn't change the fact that what I was doing was cheating, nor that Draylor's selling a system that facillates said cheating.