@Salome doesn't like me, from the one interaction I've had with her.
Glom is pretty great about this kind of thing, actually, but I'm asking more about Lusty in general.
Actually, I like everyone. It's just that @Riluna being a Moondancer in the past really places a lot of judgements on my character IG. Please try to figure out how to distinguish OOC from RP. And, if you tried to interact more, maybe my character's opinion of your own would change.
Now aside from that, I have longed to be VA since I have joined up in Glomdoring - Which is true. But VA, is, essentially a lot of hard work, a lot of time spent teaching people how to understand combat mechanics, helping them hunt, teaching them about RP, writing books, encouraging others to go out and do things that they have never done before. While @Tarkenton did court votes, which is true, and while that is necessary in politics, I had hoped that by my work alone it would be enough to speak for itself. I'm not an arrogant person, and I've mellowed out Salome's RP to accomodate for the fact that I truly want to help other individuals succeed and it's not that confusing to know that this time around. It is not about popularity in my case, or opinion, it is about who works so hard to want to utilise the tools that VA provides. And if those are given to people, any people, it makes things even better for the community IG. Just like the recent influx of Celestian Vernal Demigods (good on you), I can tell you guys have been working hard. @Tarkenton's brief VA experience in Glomdoring told me a lot about the visibility factor, while @Crek, who is well deserving too, told me about how the more older, dedicated players should be rewarded too.
It's not about cliques. As @Xenthos said, I decided to have an all-inclusive OOC clan for those in Glomdoring, and it's thrived. Especially when we have the Court making OOC connnections. It really helps us feel more like a community.
(I keep on editing my post)
@Yehn has some really good points about the tone of who's around. If there is a lot of negativity surrounding VA status, pushing people, and beating people into participation, that's not going to make people stick around. It's also not going to make people log in. Hallifax and Glomdoring are really cool places, and while I love them both, some-times things happen which make me feel icky about hanging around. That's all human, we're all human, and we definitely all have ways to overcome the negativity that is generated IG. @Sylandra also makes some good points about getting yourself out there, if you aren't brave and try to keep an air of happiness around you, be an adult, that's also something that can help you too. And even I'm working on that. It's thanks to people like her and @Falmiis, that I'm growing in these areas.
The apple is cold, crisp, and sour as the juices fill your mouth. As you consume the fruit, you glimpse, for a moment, a massive, shadowy figure, Her snow-white hair framing a perfect, icy-eyed visage. Beneath you, a vast, perfect web of silken strands lies - and, for a moment, you realize that you too are part of it, weaver and strand both - and home.
So what is the point of this thread? So far it just seems like a passive-aggressive airing of grievances. Is your beef with cliques? They're not going away and they're really not a problem. Cliques are the natural outcome in any social setting, individuals who agree are going to spend time with each other, invite in other like-minded people, and if they make a majority they're going to make decisions. If you want to be invited to that big kids table reach out to them and find out what they look for in people.
Is your problem that combat is a big part of the game? Yeah, best advice for that then is play a different game. Conflict and PvP is a huge part of Lusternia and isn't going away and is not going to stop being important to each org. You don't have to be good at it but it goes a long way if you show up and help. Spam some hindering abilities and have a basic knowledge of curing and it will go a long way in a group fight.
How did you get the friends you did, @Sylandra? Just being yourself? Did you have to be a special snowflake or did it just turn out that way?
Also, this is probably part of the reason people are not climbing over themselves to play with you. You maybe didn't mean it to but this reads as incredibly rude. Sylandra's advice is on the nose. Be nice, put yourself out there, show off what you do, and you'll pull people in. Quizzing them about why they have friends and calling them a special snowflake won't.
Fair. I'll drop it, personally. The deeper issue that spawned my thoughts for this thread weren't related to any character you know me by. It's that any new character just can't break in, nor does anybody I try to introduce to this game. They echo a few concerns I have, but my own concerns are a bit wider. Some things are just too-ingrained for new people? But I, personally, have a few grievances of my own over the last decade, and those certainly bleed through.
No offense meant @Sylandra, if that read that way. I was trying to play up the hyperbole to emphasize whatever the point of this actually was. If there is none, if nobody can recognize it, maybe it's just me. That's okay. I tried to bring you up @Sylandra, hyperbole and all, because even I know of you (even if we've never played together), and I want to find out why.
But maybe I have a bit too much bitter to pull of my point they way I mean.
Mayor Steingrim, the Grand Schema says to you, "Well, as I recall you kinda leave a mark whereever you go."
Ok, having trouble breaking in is a legit complaint but I'm not exactly sure what could be changed to help out with that. The OOC org-wide clan probably is one of the better way. The advice for breaking into Lusternia is really the same advice you'd give someone if they were breaking into a new school, job, warcraft guild (do people still play that?). You've got to reach out and find people who click with you. I've been having to do this lately coming back to the game after a really long absence. The majority of people I played with are gone from the game. I've been confused for a new player an embarrassing amount of times. However, each time it's been because they thought I was very excited and ambitious for a new player. All I've been doing to get the impression is going to people and either saying "Hey, I don't know you and I want to" or going "I don't know about this thing and it looks like you do, can you help?".
Does that work for you Othero? Are you able to make friends with people you don't know that way, be part of an inner circle an all? To feel important? Do they respect and validate you? THAT is the point of this thread.
For many, that doesn't happen. I want to find out why and how that happens. I'm sorry I can be a bitch about things.
Mayor Steingrim, the Grand Schema says to you, "Well, as I recall you kinda leave a mark whereever you go."
That's a really insecure question. I don't know. I am not that person and can't tell you if they really respect me and I don't care if they validate me. I validate myself because I'm happy with how I play and the work I produce in game. I know I'm a part of the inner circle I intentionally built and I asked for and got a voice in whatever org inner circle there seems to be. I couldn't tell you if they listen to me but they let me air my opinions. I also think I've made friends that way, I feel more comfortable and more in touch with those in my guild, city, and order who I've reached out to.
EDIT: Short answer, Lusternia works best if you self-motivate and self-reward.
Does going, "I want to be respected and validated by the Cool Kids" ever really work out well? It never seems to in movies; I can't see it working much better in real life interactions either. If you go into a social situation acting needy, people are going to react to that. Far better to just be yourself, imo. Begging for / demanding acceptance just feels like a bad way to approach things...
Does going, "I want to be respected and validated by the Cool Kids" ever really work out well? It never seems to in movies; I can't see it working much better in real life interactions either. If you go into a social situation acting needy, people are going to react to that. Far better to just be yourself, imo. Begging for / demanding acceptance just feels like a bad way to approach things...
When our game kind of depends on the Cool Kids (the cliques) letting people in, letting new Cool Kids happen...
It's why people stick around. IMHO.
Mayor Steingrim, the Grand Schema says to you, "Well, as I recall you kinda leave a mark whereever you go."
Does going, "I want to be respected and validated by the Cool Kids" ever really work out well? It never seems to in movies; I can't see it working much better in real life interactions either. If you go into a social situation acting needy, people are going to react to that. Far better to just be yourself, imo. Begging for / demanding acceptance just feels like a bad way to approach things...
Xenthos pretty much wrote my answer for me.
2
SylandraJoin Queue for Mafia GamesThe Last Mafia Game
No offense meant @Sylandra, if that read that way. I was trying to play up the hyperbole to emphasize whatever the point of this actually was. If there is none, if nobody can recognize it, maybe it's just me. That's okay. I tried to bring you up @Sylandra, hyperbole and all, because even I know of you (even if we've never played together), and I want to find out why.
But maybe I have a bit too much bitter to pull of my point they way I mean.
I mean I'm no expert, but it could be this:
Re: Othero's points, I've appreciated the Halli OOC clan since coming back because I didn't know most of these people when I returned. And it gave me a space to goof around and say, "Guys wtf is a liquidrift halp" which is harder to say ICly. Also I get to do cool things like type out the lyrics of Top 40 songs with @Aeden and make jokes with @Maligorn even though I don't see them very often ICly.
I also went into meeting new people with an open mind. I guess I could have returned to Lusternia and done the snobby and lofty artist thing, but it's not me, and I think I'd have made a lot less friends in the process.
I've always believed in doing things because they were satisfying to me personally, and not because other people would shower me with praise for them. I wrote (and write) plays for Lusternia because I find it really, really fun, and I enjoy dragging people into rehearsals and making them actors. When people express interest in the theatrical aspect of Lusternia, I try to help out, and I've given a few people a promise of 'if you're interested in acting, next time I put something out I'll keep you mind.' I guess I've been lucky that Hallifax as an org has been really invested in its cultural scene, but I do think that's the result of a bunch of likeminded people being together. (For example, look at Gaudiguch and Glomdoring - they know what's up in combat! They got that on lock.)
But seriously, make your own fun. I'm having buckets of fun being Jadicean even though it's not something that's been rewarded every step of the way. Order shopkeeping! Who knew it was so addictive? It's made me closer with @Aithera, same as theater got me closer to @Ileein, Nihmriel, @Daraius, @Irillia, and now @Zyphora and @Allyrianne. I'm also, for better or worse, always opinionated on Halli politics, which led to me being friends with @Falmiis. There's obviously a lot of factors at play here, but "shared passions" is for me the best way to go when it comes to meeting people, and making those friendships last.
"Oh yeah, you're a naughty mayor, aren't you? Misfile that Form MA631-D. Comptroller Shevat's got a nice gemstone disc for you, but yer gonna have to beg for it."
PS: Did anyone else find it amusing when Daraius responded to Sylandra's question about Leah in whatever-game-they-are-playing-discussing-relationships with: "Friendly artist type? Ew, no thanks." Because I did.
...They're not going away and they're really not a problem. Cliques are the natural outcome in any social setting, individuals who agree are going to spend time with each other, invite in other like-minded people, and if they make a majority they're going to make decisions. If you want to be invited to that big kids table reach out to them and find out what they look for in people. ...
How did you get the friends you did, @Sylandra? Just being yourself? Did you have to be a special snowflake or did it just turn out that way?
I agree with @Othero that this sounds rude (p.s. HAI OHTERO HOW YOU DOIN' BUDDY).
Concerning @Salome 's statement of "Please try to figure out how to distinguish OOC from RP."
I agree, but this is the major problem that @Riluna is talking about. Cliques often merge OOC and IC interests, due to their 'close' OOC relationship with one another that spills over into the IC world. This merger of interests can sometimes result in the exclusion of certain individuals based on an OOC basis bolstered by further support from their friends.
Let's also not forgot that many of these characters involved in a clique are often in higher-up elected IG positions. As we are all humans who occasionally take this game way too seriously, this can result in a harsher slant on individuals that we find unappealing/a threat to our IG offices.
In order to break up the negativity, please enjoy the following song:
I've definitely had some issues with breaking into groups. I'm an introvert, as well, which makes the efforts taxing.
However, I've continued to push. I don't know if I would consider myself on an inside circle yet, but I've made a few friends that have positively impacted my gaming experience. I've built some bonds, and continue to develop new ones. They've supported and helped while I've wrestled through some difficulties with the game and settling in, as well as helped me better define my character.
While there are certainly areas I'd like to gain better exposure and 'break into', it's a start, I don't feel rushed, and I don't expect it to happen instantly. I don't feel entitled to being pulled into them, relationships are a two way street (though I do wish some were more open/amicable, though that's also their right as players).
I'm not expressing anything exactly the way I mean. I'd like to blame it on the opium, but eh.
Do I have a point or am I just that wrong? Am I just expressing it badly or is there no point?
I think you're expressing it badly. You have a point but if your hope and expectation is that the game will change it won't. If you're looking for advice on what you can change about yourself then that's not a bad thread. I think you've gotten some good advice on that and other people may be able to chime in on how they found their place in the game.
I'm not expressing anything exactly the way I mean. I'd like to blame it on the opium, but eh.
Do I have a point or am I just that wrong? Am I just expressing it badly or is there no point?
I think you're expressing it badly. You have a point but if your hope and expectation is that the game will change it won't. If you're looking for advice on what you can change about yourself then that's not a bad thread. I think you've gotten some good advice on that and other people may be able to chime in on how they found their place in the game.
My only hope is that any of those who follow will fit into this game. If they can't discover how, this game will die slowly. We need to let them in. And none of the people I know IRL feel like they can belong.
Mayor Steingrim, the Grand Schema says to you, "Well, as I recall you kinda leave a mark whereever you go."
Surround yourself with people who share your interests and put time into it. There's no shortcut. If you're saying that the people who try out the game aren't immediately privy to the deepest of friendships then I don't know what to say. Lusternia isn't a casual game generally speaking, unfortunately.
If you have a group of people who you know IRL who are playing together why don't you form your own group and meet people as a group? That seems like an even easier way to fit in then having to go it alone and meet people.
Concerning @Salome 's statement of "Please try to figure out how to distinguish OOC from RP."
I agree, but this is the major problem that @Riluna is talking about. Cliques often merge OOC and IC interests, due to their 'close' OOC relationship with one another that spills over into the IC world. This merger of interests can sometimes result in the exclusion of certain individuals based on an OOC basis bolstered by further support from their friends.
Let's also not forgot that many of these characters involved in a clique are often in higher-up elected IG positions. As we are all humans who occasionally take this game way too seriously, this can result in a harsher slant on individuals that we find unappealing/a threat to our IG offices.
*snip*
I'm just saying that it's a two way street. People can assume that there is a 'clique' or bias because the judgement of a character, perhaps because of their status within the community IG. And some bias' cannot be distinguished in RP, because they are supposed to be present there. OOCly, they are going to be there because that's naturally what a game of conflict extends and appeals to some of our competitive natures. However, I don't believe it's an excuse. I have found the an inclusive org clan, really helps put us into perspective, that it's just a game, and we all can cool off on our sides before reaching out to others after the conflict is said and done.
The apple is cold, crisp, and sour as the juices fill your mouth. As you consume the fruit, you glimpse, for a moment, a massive, shadowy figure, Her snow-white hair framing a perfect, icy-eyed visage. Beneath you, a vast, perfect web of silken strands lies - and, for a moment, you realize that you too are part of it, weaver and strand both - and home.
I can buy that. I play DnD and find Lusternia and DnD itch very different scratches. I play DnD to tell a story and for overly complicated math. I play Lusternia to play politics, be involved in a story (these are different things I promise), and for a very different type of combat.
I think the biggest difference is that you're always the most important characters in DnD. The world is literally built for you and your small group and will bend itself to you. In Lusternia that's not true. It's you and a few hundred people and sometimes the world isn't going to bend to you. Lots of times it won't.
Surround yourself with people who share your interests and put time into it. There's no shortcut. If you're saying that the people who try out the game aren't immediately privy to the deepest of friendships then I don't know what to say. Lusternia isn't a casual game generally speaking, unfortunately.
"Oh yeah, you're a naughty mayor, aren't you? Misfile that Form MA631-D. Comptroller Shevat's got a nice gemstone disc for you, but yer gonna have to beg for it."
Tell your story that you want to tell, try to show it to people, and be ok with not always being the protagonist or in charge. You also need to be ok with smaller victories. The things you do are going to be less often world-shattering the way they can be in a tabletop game. And really, be ok with not being the person in charge.
But even feeling involved? That's important, no? You don't have to be THE hero to be A hero, and I really don't think we let people be heroes like we used to.
Mayor Steingrim, the Grand Schema says to you, "Well, as I recall you kinda leave a mark whereever you go."
Rephrased, how does a DnD player adapt to Lusternia?
See, you ask how a DnD player adapts to Lusternia but the vibe I've got from this thread so far is that you really want to know how Lusternia adapts to a DnD player. Let's make it clear. The answer to the latter is that it doesn't.
DnD and Lusternia are completely different games. DnD is (almost) all action concentrated into a finite period of time. If you turn up to a session you can generally expect there something going on even if you don't initiate it yourself. In Lusternia, you can be logged in for hours and nothing can happen if you don't go out there to make things happen. There is also no feeling of grinding in DnD. If your character stays alive through enough sessions they'll become very powerful. In Lusternia you really do need to put in some effort into doing monotonous things such as bashing to get to the highest levels.
Involved in what? That's really vague and there are a ton of things to be involved in. Your city? An Order? A guild? Someone's personal RP? Involved in combat?
Being able to just jump in and be useful with a revolt was pretty neat for me (even if that just meant watching an NPC for it to be ready to go). There's ministries you can become aides to, can design things for your city cartels (even without having the skill), power to bring in, etc. Most cities have some sort of reward structure for being useful.
All of the above, @Othero. THAT is the point of this thread, if there is one. Coming from such apparently disparate environments, can you be involved in something as simple as an Order?
Mayor Steingrim, the Grand Schema says to you, "Well, as I recall you kinda leave a mark whereever you go."
Comments
Now aside from that, I have longed to be VA since I have joined up in Glomdoring - Which is true. But VA, is, essentially a lot of hard work, a lot of time spent teaching people how to understand combat mechanics, helping them hunt, teaching them about RP, writing books, encouraging others to go out and do things that they have never done before. While @Tarkenton did court votes, which is true, and while that is necessary in politics, I had hoped that by my work alone it would be enough to speak for itself. I'm not an arrogant person, and I've mellowed out Salome's RP to accomodate for the fact that I truly want to help other individuals succeed and it's not that confusing to know that this time around. It is not about popularity in my case, or opinion, it is about who works so hard to want to utilise the tools that VA provides. And if those are given to people, any people, it makes things even better for the community IG. Just like the recent influx of Celestian Vernal Demigods (good on you), I can tell you guys have been working hard. @Tarkenton's brief VA experience in Glomdoring told me a lot about the visibility factor, while @Crek, who is well deserving too, told me about how the more older, dedicated players should be rewarded too.
It's not about cliques. As @Xenthos said, I decided to have an all-inclusive OOC clan for those in Glomdoring, and it's thrived. Especially when we have the Court making OOC connnections. It really helps us feel more like a community.
(I keep on editing my post)
@Yehn has some really good points about the tone of who's around. If there is a lot of negativity surrounding VA status, pushing people, and beating people into participation, that's not going to make people stick around. It's also not going to make people log in. Hallifax and Glomdoring are really cool places, and while I love them both, some-times things happen which make me feel icky about hanging around. That's all human, we're all human, and we definitely all have ways to overcome the negativity that is generated IG. @Sylandra also makes some good points about getting yourself out there, if you aren't brave and try to keep an air of happiness around you, be an adult, that's also something that can help you too. And even I'm working on that. It's thanks to people like her and @Falmiis, that I'm growing in these areas.
No offense meant @Sylandra, if that read that way. I was trying to play up the hyperbole to emphasize whatever the point of this actually was. If there is none, if nobody can recognize it, maybe it's just me. That's okay. I tried to bring you up @Sylandra, hyperbole and all, because even I know of you (even if we've never played together), and I want to find out why.
But maybe I have a bit too much bitter to pull of my point they way I mean.
Xenthos pretty much wrote my answer for me.
Do I have a point or am I just that wrong? Am I just expressing it badly or is there no point?
I'm just saying that it's a two way street. People can assume that there is a 'clique' or bias because the judgement of a character, perhaps because of their status within the community IG. And some bias' cannot be distinguished in RP, because they are supposed to be present there. OOCly, they are going to be there because that's naturally what a game of conflict extends and appeals to some of our competitive natures. However, I don't believe it's an excuse. I have found the an inclusive org clan, really helps put us into perspective, that it's just a game, and we all can cool off on our sides before reaching out to others after the conflict is said and done.
See, you ask how a DnD player adapts to Lusternia but the vibe I've got from this thread so far is that you really want to know how Lusternia adapts to a DnD player. Let's make it clear. The answer to the latter is that it doesn't.
DnD and Lusternia are completely different games. DnD is (almost) all action concentrated into a finite period of time. If you turn up to a session you can generally expect there something going on even if you don't initiate it yourself. In Lusternia, you can be logged in for hours and nothing can happen if you don't go out there to make things happen. There is also no feeling of grinding in DnD. If your character stays alive through enough sessions they'll become very powerful. In Lusternia you really do need to put in some effort into doing monotonous things such as bashing to get to the highest levels.