Skip manses, since they're generally the AFK place to be. Odds are that if you're in a manse, you're AFK. Add in all known planes (including Limbo, since I believe the *bix rooms are there) and it should be fine.
I know I certainly like being able to hide out in manses, but I think I'd prefer this be limited to privacy rooms only, as I said earlier. A lot of shopping happens in manses, so they aren't afk zones by default, and I'd like the ability to control whether or not I am visible to my org without being forced to leave my home.
Skip manses, since they're generally the AFK place to be. Odds are that if you're in a manse, you're AFK. Add in all known planes (including Limbo, since I believe the *bix rooms are there) and it should be fine.
I know I certainly like being able to hide out in manses, but I think I'd prefer this be limited to privacy rooms only, as I said earlier. A lot of shopping happens in manses, so they aren't afk zones by default, and I'd like the ability to control whether or not I am visible to my org without being forced to leave my home.
Perhaps an AFK flag that you could toggle on while in a manse only (and would switch to off immediately upon leaving a manse) which would cause you to not show up? That way if you're planning to just stand around and do nothing and don't want to interact, you won't be visible, but if you're just hanging out in aetherspace and don't mind being seen, you're fine.
I'd really like it if the quickwho and who playercounts reflected the total number of players online, regardless of cloaking gems and the like. Cloaking gems should hide the name from the wholist, but not the count from the number. Otherwise, the game just seems dead when you check these global wholists.
@Phoebus - any reason why that couldn't be achieved using the existing privacy artifact? If I want to afk, I know to set up a room in my manse with that option (or all of them), and go stand in it. If not, I appear in lists as normal.
Because manses are officially sanctioned afk spots and the artifact... is an expensive artifact with no other purpose. You shouldn't need to pay in credits just to make yourself scarce.
Basically what Enyalida said. I don't think everything needs to be tied to an artifact, especially if the idea is to AFK, which is an entirely OOC action.
Maybe privacy gems (which really don't have a whole lot of use) can block people from the new CWHO thing.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
Because manses are officially sanctioned afk spots and the artifact... is an expensive artifact with no other purpose. You shouldn't need to pay in credits just to make yourself scarce.
I do understand not wanting to have to pay for artifacts, but in this case, I'll have to agree to disagree. It's one of the cheaper artifacts, has little functionality otherwise, and I think it's a fair trade-off for causing the game to look a bit less active than it really is. Similar to the gem of cloaking (though I know that has combat advantages). Besides - there's nothing wrong with just switching off channels when afk - with this suggestion you'd show as in the Aetherways anyway, so there'd be an assumption and understanding that people residing there could be afk/off-channel.
It's not 'not wanting to have to pay to have artifacts', it's 'not wanting to pay for previously and reasonably free features of the game'. There's a difference between buying artifacts that enhance or improve gameplay in new and optional ways, and gating existent content behind new pay walls. The difference in your example is that the gem of cloaking provides an addition to the game, while making people only be hidden if they're standing in privacy rooms in a manse takes what people can do now (stand in a manse and afk) and makes you have to pay for it. So yeah, artifacts shouldn't be free. Some things should be free. Therefore, some things should not be artifacts.
I mean, realistically, how much time do you spend shopping in manses? I'd venture to guess not all that much. I don't see any point in adding in an artifact to accommodate manse shoppers specifically.
I am cool with that mechanic so long as I can opt out of it without buying something else. I don't like being visible, people try to talk to me. Ick.
I'd really like it if the quickwho and who playercounts reflected the total number of players online, regardless of cloaking gems and the like. Cloaking gems should hide the name from the wholist, but not the count from the number. Otherwise, the game just seems dead when you check these global wholists.
(*) Currently, there are 47 Lusternians on this Plane and 0 on other Planes.
Do cloaking gems not hide people both from the list and the numbering at the end? I remember it being said that they did not, but I can't remember either way.
Okay, that's what I thought. Might be worth a change to include some very public note that this is the case. Change the 'This many Lusternians on this plane" message to reference that the number is absolute and does count shrouded people, so that they don't need to sit and count the names and then check it against the number to come to that conclusion.
You can not sense a single person. There are 52 people in Lusternia. 10905h, 6865m, 6865e, 10p, 26660en, 26660w Belrx<>-say tulahuar
You say, "Tulahuar." Your necklace ceases to protect you. 10905h, 6865m, 6865e, 10p, 26660en, 26660w Belrx- Xenthos. (*) Currently, there is 1 Lusternian on this Plane and 51 on other Planes. 10905h, 6865m, 6865e, 10p, 26660en, 26660w Belrx-say tulahuar
You say, "Tulahuar." You feel an ebon necklace bound with a shadowfire gem warm on your skin, just before it flares briefly with a soft light. 10905h, 6865m, 6865e, 10p, 26660en, 26660w Belrx<>- You can not sense a single person. There are 52 people in Lusternia.
Cloaking gems have zero effect upon the total number of players.
So the "on other Planes" bit includes cloaked people as well? Why not have them be listed as on-Plane but cloaked, so that it doesn't look like people on Prime are so terribly alone?
Because that is how the super-old code works. It may even be how cloaking gems function, by assigning us all to the "cloaked" plane so we do not show on the list. Cannot say for sure as I have never seen the code, but it is definitely plausible given how old the code is.
Cloaking gems don't make Lusternia seem anymore dead than say...manses. Or the Astral plane.
On the one hand, you're right, but on the other hand, that doesn't make this sort of player-hiding behavior acceptable for a game that wants to retain new players. A newbie logging logging on right now is going to see a QW that shows there are only ~3 people in the entire game that he or she can interact with until they learn how to reach the other planes, and that's not the kind of environment that makes you want to stick around and play the game. The fact that there are many more people online and on Prime who they could be talking to is made entirely irrelevant by the cloaking gems' current behavior.
Because that is how the super-old code works. It may even be how cloaking gems function, by assigning us all to the "cloaked" plane so we do not show on the list. Cannot say for sure as I have never seen the code, but it is definitely plausible given how old the code is.
Okay, but there's clearly a function in the code to count the number of players in a given plane. As such, it'd be easy to update QW to output something like "Currently, there are 3 Lusternians on this Plane, 43 on other Planes, and 6 people cloaked from your vision" (simply summing the players on the cloaked plane and appending that to the end of the message). That makes it clear that you're not necessarily alone on Prime, just that you can't see where everyone is.
You can't say "It'd be easy to update QW" if you have not seen the code. This old legacy stuff is terrible. Something that you'd think would be easy (like updating all old warrior weapons to be the same base stats) was actually impossible when the code was consulted.
You can say that you'd prefer it, just can't make an assumption as to how much effort an overhaul would take.
I really don't understand what you're asking for. You want retire gems?
edit: Incidentally, I think the true scenario is far more complex than you are making it out to be. These novices can still see and communicate with gem'd folk over CT and GT (and Newbie for that matter). The majority of the population does not have a gem and removing it ultimately means a handful more people show up on QWHO (those with then defunct gems who happen to not be off prime) and the cost is revoking an artifact that a lot of people pay IRE $$$ for.
So I'm skeptical of the true benefit here. Especially if there is no addressing of off plane on QWHO, or even if being offplane needs to be addressed at all. Is a list of names more "active" than a number? That's impossible to say without some sort of true newbie poll.
I really don't understand what you're asking for. You want retire gems?
No, I just want it to be clearer in QW/who/whatever that there are more people on Prime than one might think. Names don't need to be revealed, and the entire cloaking plane can just be listed as 'cloaked people you can't see' without a specific plane if that's simpler. My goal is just to make it seem like someone on Prime-- the only plane a true newbie can access for a while-- is not super-isolated due to a lack of visible people in the area.
I suppose I don't see the benefit in just shuffling numbers around between "this plane" and "other planes," when you consider the name does not show either way and a newbie can't communicate with a name they don't know about. The summation of the numbers is the same either way. Do new players perceive "other planes" as people who aren't playing, and "this plane" as people who are? I would venture to guess that's not the case.
I suppose I don't see the benefit in just shuffling numbers around between "this plane" and "other planes," when you consider the name does not show either way and a newbie can't communicate with a name they don't know about. The summation of the numbers is the same either way. Do new players perceive "other planes" as people who aren't playing, and "this plane" as people who are? I would venture to guess that's not the case.
My suggestion is based off the fact that you can't interact in-person with anyone off your plane, and that's patently obvious even to a newbie when QW is segregated as it is now. Separating cloaked players out from the off-plane group at least hints at the chance that you can interact with them, which is appealing versus the absolute certainty that they're off-plane and unreachable by a newbie's means of transportation.
I think we need to get rid of the limitations on cross-planar communications and show everyone on CW/GW, at least for the planes connected to Prime. I'd argue it should apply to bubbles too, but I can see why we might not want to do that.
I have to agree with Celina on this. Knowing there are 18 people on prime with cloaking on doesn't do a newbie any good as far as interaction, since they can't interact with people whose names they don't know. WHO is still going to show just four names or whatever, leaving the newbies in no better position. They'll still only be able to rely on CWHO to get names of people online in their org, but cloaking gems are ignored by CWHO anyways.
Further... doesn't this reduce a slight benefit of the gems as is, namely hiding presence while -not- on prime? As is, a gemmed person on, say, Water, should still show as off-plane, making it at the very least slightly easier to be there unnoticed. If someone goes to Water, does WHO, finds there is a person on plane but cloaked, well, then the alarm bells can start ringing. Sure, it's probably a minor point... but it's still a nerf.
Opening up CWHO and GWHO to all/most planes seems like a much better idea for getting rid of that lonely feeling.
The purpose of writing is to inflate weak ideas, obscure pure reasoning, and inhibit clarity. With a little practice, writing can be an intimidating and impenetrable fog!
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could just offer a CWHO OFF or similar, provided people wouldn't just always turn it off, then.
I do understand not wanting to have to pay for artifacts, but in this case, I'll have to agree to disagree. It's one of the cheaper artifacts, has little functionality otherwise, and I think it's a fair trade-off for causing the game to look a bit less active than it really is. Similar to the gem of cloaking (though I know that has combat advantages).
Besides - there's nothing wrong with just switching off channels when afk - with this suggestion you'd show as in the Aetherways anyway, so there'd be an assumption and understanding that people residing there could be afk/off-channel.
Do you guys not see that when you qwho?
You can not sense a single person.
There are 52 people in Lusternia.
10905h, 6865m, 6865e, 10p, 26660en, 26660w Belrx<>-say tulahuar
You say, "Tulahuar."
Your necklace ceases to protect you.
10905h, 6865m, 6865e, 10p, 26660en, 26660w Belrx-
Xenthos.
(*) Currently, there is 1 Lusternian on this Plane and 51 on other Planes.
10905h, 6865m, 6865e, 10p, 26660en, 26660w Belrx-say tulahuar
You say, "Tulahuar."
You feel an ebon necklace bound with a shadowfire gem warm on your skin, just before it flares briefly with a soft light.
10905h, 6865m, 6865e, 10p, 26660en, 26660w Belrx<>-
You can not sense a single person.
There are 52 people in Lusternia.
Cloaking gems have zero effect upon the total number of players.
You can say that you'd prefer it, just can't make an assumption as to how much effort an overhaul would take.
Further... doesn't this reduce a slight benefit of the gems as is, namely hiding presence while -not- on prime? As is, a gemmed person on, say, Water, should still show as off-plane, making it at the very least slightly easier to be there unnoticed. If someone goes to Water, does WHO, finds there is a person on plane but cloaked, well, then the alarm bells can start ringing. Sure, it's probably a minor point... but it's still a nerf.
Opening up CWHO and GWHO to all/most planes seems like a much better idea for getting rid of that lonely feeling.