I think it's perfectly fine to offer up suggestions to thematic issues but there are a couple things to keep in mind to temper expectations.
1) We don't know all the considerations
Sometime things are shot down because they conflict with future plans. For all we know there could be trees with spirits in them on the horizon.
Sometimes they are shot down because they don't mesh with the original intent that may or may not have been communicated clearly.
2) Things that have mechanical or material changes complicate things greatly.
You get into balance issues and coding time which is a lot to ask for just to get a thematic change. Volunteer resources are limited and highly valuable.A huge project to re-tool something that is already implemented and working as designed for the benefit of 2 people will probably not happen.
Computer code and platforms come in all shapes and sizes but one universal constant is that some things are easier than others. On the user end we are left with an imperfect understanding of the finer points and what you think of as a minor tweak could actually be a monumental task.
TL;DR
By all means ask for things and share your ideas. The odds are you will be shot down (including for reasons that may have nothing to do with you or the concept) but the odds of them making changes you thought up in your head and didn't tell anyone about are significantly lower.
The flower lines have nothing to do with the afflictions, because with the exception of one line, they weren't updated after having their afflictions changed. So, Hornedlily still gives the message hinting that it deals out weakness though it no longer does that, and so on.
Toxic spore clouds from flowers (such as the humble and nonmagical bluebell) seem unlikely, but dreamy magics, ancestral/spirit evocations and minor fae interaction appear more in-tune with the passive Seren-theme.
I hardly think Saran was asking to have Spirits loitering around in his branches, Enyalida. My perception thus far has been that he would like sensible reactions to his attacks that fit the passive, Seren-centric theme established by current mechanics.
This is more or less what already happens with the spores. The clouds of combined pollen aren't overwhelming people by being incredibly toxic, they're magical. The descriptions display that to varying degrees. Example: during the Glinshari spore, ancestral flames ignite in the pollen and shape into rampaging stags that gore enemies.
That's exactly what he suggested on Calas (our combat clan), instead of summoning flowers that do periodic attacks, summon spirits (a la spiritsingers).
I agree re:garland. I think the message could pretty easily be made less cutesy without taking away from the idea of it, fauna chucking magical, renewable parts of the Wildewood at enemies.
I don't see stags replacing flowers anytime soon. Remember, the woods all come from a time where Moon and Night, Hart and Crow are dead. Both Serenwilde and Glomdoring are gone then replaced by Serens/Gloms who became the wood. Wyrdenwoods got thorns and leaves and critters who reside in them(wasps, locusts, no crows!). I don't think the flowers make Wildewood a joke. Personally, I see it the alternate timeline Serenwilde's way of adapting, flourishing in a way that preserves the beauty of old Seren. And if Treehug is an issue, maybe you can have it change to falcon punch. Personally, I'd like to see root related skills(roots flinging dirt/rocks at someone's eyes). I don't know what'd make a good erplacement for flowers if not leaves.
I would have thought that wasps and locusts would have a thematic connection to the Blacktalon as wasps are part of Crow Druidry and weren't most of the "creepy crawlies" of the basin created by Viravain, offering a link through Crow to her creations?
Sadly, Charune tended to create... larger things so that sort of link is away from us.
I think it's perfectly fine to offer up suggestions to thematic issues but there are a couple things to keep in mind to temper expectations.
1) We don't know all the considerations
Sometime things are shot down because they conflict with future plans. For all we know there could be trees with spirits in them on the horizon.
Sometimes they are shot down because they don't mesh with the original intent that may or may not have been communicated clearly.
2) Things that have mechanical or material changes complicate things greatly.
You get into balance issues and coding time which is a lot to ask for just to get a thematic change. Volunteer resources are limited and highly valuable.A huge project to re-tool something that is already implemented and working as designed for the benefit of 2 people will probably not happen.
Computer code and platforms come in all shapes and sizes but one universal constant is that some things are easier than others. On the user end we are left with an imperfect understanding of the finer points and what you think of as a minor tweak could actually be a monumental task.
TL;DR
By all means ask for things and share your ideas. The odds are you will be shot down (including for reasons that may have nothing to do with you or the concept) but the odds of them making changes you thought up in your head and didn't tell anyone about are significantly lower.
One of the bigger things that is raising a flag for me is actually from "Ask Estarra Vol.3" which dealt with ackleberry and showed us a map of the forest, could be a joke might not be, that had about a third to a half of the forest being dubbed the "vale of flowers" and "the gardens".
Serenwilde does have an arboretum, though it doesn't appear to be as dominant, but we also have the burial cairns, the centaur hills, the river carving through it, that gods damned road, the Naos, even the tar pits kind of count.
The epic quest involves speaking with ancestral and great spirits, perhaps a bit of a unity vibe, but feels very much about calling on the powers of the past and physically exploring the history of Serenwilde.
I've said it before, but Serenwilde, whether it's a good thing for them or not, clings to the past and always tries to find it's answers there.
This sort of thing can be expressed without a floral theme, which feels like it would be the theme of a skill that's released in Ackleberry (I'm imagining binding/choking vines for Jojobo) and also reminds me of the (non-tainted)geomancer hippies that we've seen.
So yeah, it's feeling like some of the theme here is more related to other orgs/aspects of the game. I can really easily imagine Ackleberry being this place where you go up to try to pet the bear cub only to cry "Momma bear please don't maul me", then you try to sniff the pretty flower and start screaming "Oh my gods, why is the... HOW IS THE FLOWER MAULING ME?!".
But the image of Serenwilde is more subtle for me, it's the mysterious forest filled with ghosts, spirits, and other things, that you wander into and never wander out of again.
In the mean time, it wouldn't warrant a report-level change to fix the flower messages, as they are essentially typo'd, having not been changed to keep up with the special report. If you write up some appropriate flower-attack messages for the different afflictions, I'll pitch them.
In the mean time, it wouldn't warrant a report-level change to fix the flower messages, as they are essentially typo'd, having not been changed to keep up with the special report. If you write up some appropriate flower-attack messages for the different afflictions, I'll pitch them.
I feel that the discussion needs to continue, and at the very least, I still feel that the flowers remaining as flowers just feels awkward and wrong.
Changing them to roots, or berries, or fruits, or carvings (which would be reminiscent almost of the stones in the grove), or anything else would be vaguely better, to my mind at least, because they have less direct correspondences with other forests.
I could write lines about how flowers break your bones, but then I feel like I would be doing something that I feel is ultimately inappropriate for the guild, plus cause and effect seem too disconnected for anything decent.
A probably poor possibility I thought of while going to get lunch. This would be along the lines of the sap containing memories but also weaponising them against their enemies.
Faint emerald light sparkles within the jagged carvings on Saran's trunk. Childhood memories of broken bones fill your mind joined by dreamy images of pain yet to be experienced. As they merge, you scream out in pain as your right leg snaps bringing you back to reality.
Though that's probably a bit too long for a tick effect.
"Meae's horned lily flowers sway, releasing a trickle of orange pollen. Bright flowers blossom on your body, withering your limbs as they grow and die.
I think that'd bring a more interesting theme to flowers, the forest forcibly invading/reclaiming your body (or trying to) and that being the source of the afflictions.
EDIT: That's not a final suggestion, just a theme.. it's not very well written, heh.
"Meae's horned lily flowers sway, releasing a trickle of orange pollen. Bright flowers blossom on your body, withering your limbs as they grow and die.
I think that'd bring a more interesting theme to flowers, the forest forcibly invading/reclaiming your body (or trying to) and that being the source of the afflictions.
I feel that this actually steps even further away from the Hartstone theme.
The other option is that if to avoid personal memories could be to write them so that they are implied to be from someone or something else, perhaps memories of broken branches.
It's rather overt, but the idea would be that yes memories and dreams combine to create an effect in the present.
Keeping in mind that flowers eventually seed, I'd prefer to see the afflictions come from plants growing out of the person rather than flowers, since while flowers are part of the Seren, they're not a big part.
I'd certainly like to see more Hartstone-y stuff from the skills, since at the moment I feel -very- distinct from the guild.
Keeping in mind that flowers eventually seed, I'd prefer to see the afflictions come from plants growing out of the person rather than flowers, since while flowers are part of the Seren, they're not a big part.
I'd certainly like to see more Hartstone-y stuff from the skills, since at the moment I feel -very- distinct from the guild.
Feeling distinct from the guild is kinda the whole point.
Keeping in mind that flowers eventually seed, I'd prefer to see the afflictions come from plants growing out of the person rather than flowers, since while flowers are part of the Seren, they're not a big part.
I'd certainly like to see more Hartstone-y stuff from the skills, since at the moment I feel -very- distinct from the guild.
Feeling distinct from the guild is kinda the whole point.
That's a terrible point, especially when you consider personal sacrifice in the scope of Hartstone rp. If the Wildewood were more in line with the theme of the guild I could see various rp opportunities for the two factions to develop, first and foremost the divide between those that remained true to the path of Glinshari and the Druids of the Hartstone against those those willing to sacrifice so much to have the closest bond they can with the Serenwilde.
I suppose this raises the question, do the Wyrdenwood and chemancers feel that their choice means significantly distancing themselves from their actual guild? Are you still an Air Mage regardless of whether that is expressed through Aeromancy or Aerochemantics? I'd be curious to see if there might be an argument that Aquachemantics, while very definitely linked to the water plane, is closer to the light than Aquamancy.
The woods and chemencers are pretty distinctly different in terms if RP.
You are a giant tree-man using powers that were developed in a time where you, quite literally, would be the Serenwilde.
Maybe it's a little different for Wyrdenwood because the Wyrd. Either way, being one of two active trees means that your actions can help shape the RP of a whole race. You don't need to rely on the skills to do that, just your own imagination.
The woods and chemencers are pretty distinctly different in terms if RP.
You are a giant tree-man using powers that were developed in a time where you, quite literally, would be the Serenwilde.
Maybe it's a little different for Wyrdenwood because the Wyrd. Either way, being one of two active trees means that your actions can help shape the RP of a whole race. You don't need to rely on the skills to do that, just your own imagination.
Except that the issue that at the least I have with is, is that I don't feel like that design has been achieved. I feel more that I'm a walking garden, not the Serenwilde. If it did there really wouldn't be an issue.
Yes, we can easily shape the rp of the race but that race is inherently tied to these abilities, they are a reflection of the capabilities of a member of that race. But I also have to consider how to encourage rp with the Wildewood within Serenwilde and the Hartstone, but I also don't want to work on things only to have them declared entirely wrong at a later time.
Comments
I would have thought that wasps and locusts would have a thematic connection to the Blacktalon as wasps are part of Crow Druidry and weren't most of the "creepy crawlies" of the basin created by Viravain, offering a link through Crow to her creations?
Sadly, Charune tended to create... larger things so that sort of link is away from us.
One of the bigger things that is raising a flag for me is actually from "Ask Estarra Vol.3" which dealt with ackleberry and showed us a map of the forest, could be a joke might not be, that had about a third to a half of the forest being dubbed the "vale of flowers" and "the gardens".
Serenwilde does have an arboretum, though it doesn't appear to be as dominant, but we also have the burial cairns, the centaur hills, the river carving through it, that gods damned road, the Naos, even the tar pits kind of count.
The epic quest involves speaking with ancestral and great spirits, perhaps a bit of a unity vibe, but feels very much about calling on the powers of the past and physically exploring the history of Serenwilde.
I've said it before, but Serenwilde, whether it's a good thing for them or not, clings to the past and always tries to find it's answers there.
This sort of thing can be expressed without a floral theme, which feels like it would be the theme of a skill that's released in Ackleberry (I'm imagining binding/choking vines for Jojobo) and also reminds me of the (non-tainted)geomancer hippies that we've seen.
So yeah, it's feeling like some of the theme here is more related to other orgs/aspects of the game. I can really easily imagine Ackleberry being this place where you go up to try to pet the bear cub only to cry "Momma bear please don't maul me", then you try to sniff the pretty flower and start screaming "Oh my gods, why is the... HOW IS THE FLOWER MAULING ME?!".
But the image of Serenwilde is more subtle for me, it's the mysterious forest filled with ghosts, spirits, and other things, that you wander into and never wander out of again.
I feel that the discussion needs to continue, and at the very least, I still feel that the flowers remaining as flowers just feels awkward and wrong.
Changing them to roots, or berries, or fruits, or carvings (which would be reminiscent almost of the stones in the grove), or anything else would be vaguely better, to my mind at least, because they have less direct correspondences with other forests.
I could write lines about how flowers break your bones, but then I feel like I would be doing something that I feel is ultimately inappropriate for the guild, plus cause and effect seem too disconnected for anything decent.
A probably poor possibility I thought of while going to get lunch. This would be along the lines of the sap containing memories but also weaponising them against their enemies.
Faint emerald light sparkles within the jagged carvings on Saran's trunk. Childhood memories of broken bones fill your mind joined by dreamy images of pain yet to be experienced. As they merge, you scream out in pain as your right leg snaps bringing you back to reality.
Though that's probably a bit too long for a tick effect.
I feel that this actually steps even further away from the Hartstone theme.
The other option is that if to avoid personal memories could be to write them so that they are implied to be from someone or something else, perhaps memories of broken branches.
It's rather overt, but the idea would be that yes memories and dreams combine to create an effect in the present.
You are a giant tree-man using powers that were developed in a time where you, quite literally, would be the Serenwilde.
Maybe it's a little different for Wyrdenwood because the Wyrd. Either way, being one of two active trees means that your actions can help shape the RP of a whole race. You don't need to rely on the skills to do that, just your own imagination.