Newbie Difficulties/Troubles/Concerns

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  • CaerlyrCaerlyr Member Posts: 282 Capable
    edited November 2013
    Actually, on that note. One slight issue I noticed earlier which had been brought to my attention from a newbie a few days back: After you have to fight the shadow a second time, you are required to say 'I wish to defeat the shadow' a further time. This is causing problems for some people as the tour does not state this needs saying a second time, merely that the shadow is in Newton and needs killing. Maybe if we could either add the message in, or alternatively, just have the shadow be aggro in the first Newton room?
  • IeptixIeptix Member, Moderator, Gods Posts: 819 Divine
    edited November 2013
    Caerlyr said:
    During the tour, I think he's referring to.


    It was a joke. Because I fixed it. And then someone was supposed to go look and be all, "oh my, it is fixed! Rejoice!" Or something to that effect.
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  • ShaddusShaddus His Imperial Altness Outside your window.Member Posts: 7,652 Transcendent
    Right. When you're picking an org in the intro, INFO GAUDIGUCH says that only the Pyromancers are available.
    If I'm not good enough for Lusternia, then it is no longer good enough for me.
  • CaerlyrCaerlyr Member Posts: 282 Capable
    Ieptix is going to be our ninja-fixer for bugs. I approve :D
  • ShaddusShaddus His Imperial Altness Outside your window.Member Posts: 7,652 Transcendent
    Ieptix said:
    Caerlyr said:
    During the tour, I think he's referring to.


    It was a joke. Because I fixed it. And then someone was supposed to go look and be all, "oh my, it is fixed! Rejoice!" Or something to that effect.
    Does this mean I have to roll another alt to check? I hate rolling alts.
    If I'm not good enough for Lusternia, then it is no longer good enough for me.
  • IeptixIeptix Member, Moderator, Gods Posts: 819 Divine
    No. You can trust me.
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  • ShaddusShaddus His Imperial Altness Outside your window.Member Posts: 7,652 Transcendent
    edited November 2013
    That's what I generally tell newbies, and we both know that's not true. 

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    If I'm not good enough for Lusternia, then it is no longer good enough for me.
  • CaerlyrCaerlyr Member Posts: 282 Capable
    Shaddus said:
    That's what I generally tell newbies, and we both know that's not true. 

    This comment scares me somewhat.
  • ArimisiaArimisia Member Posts: 421 Expert

    Shaddus said:
    Does this mean I have to roll another alt to check? I hate rolling alts.
    lies, since when? you only have a gawd knows how many :p
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  • RilunaRiluna Member Posts: 1,089 Mythical
    edited November 2013
    Since the guild/race selection change, it seems like novices are skipping the 20 hour collegium time, and going straight to freshman novice status. That's GNT right away, and I've been told they need to specifically CGTON now (which they don't even realize exists until they're told about it) in order to actually speak over the collegium aether.

    This is a problem because at that stage they've got so little planar learned that if they DO manage to ask questions, they're often not heard by those willing to help and not on Prime. CGT was made to bypass ordinary planar restrictions for this reason, so it would be more beneficial to have this tool available to them from the start. 

    If they're actually directed to speak and ask questions there, that's a huge plus. But at the very least, have it active automatically, so we can greet them there, and have them be heard in turn.

    Mayor Steingrim, the Grand Schema says to you, "Well, as I recall you kinda leave a mark whereever you go."
  • EveriineEveriine Wise Old Swordsbird / Brontaur Three Lakes, WIMember Posts: 2,762 Transcendent
    I did notice this when I rolled an alt--I skipped CGT entirely.

    Honestly, the whole Newbie intro process has gotten way out of hand, way too long, and way too complicated with too many variables that go wrong.
    Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"

    Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.

    Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spotMember Posts: 4,317 Transcendent
    edited November 2013
    It also serves the opposite of its intended purpose by having newbies follow their fate guide around to the exclusion of interacting with other players. And trivializes the aloof, mysterious nature of the Fates. And suggests humans are the default race. 

    I much, much preferred it when the very basics were introduced pre-Portal. :(


    I also feel this introduction misrepresents the game a bit. Nowhere else do you click links to ask questions or complete objectives.
  • EnyalidaEnyalida Nasty Woman Member Posts: 4,384 Transcendent
    Agreed. 
  • IsuneIsune Gods Posts: 438 Divine
    Daraius said:

    I also feel this introduction misrepresents the game a bit. Nowhere else do you click links to ask questions or complete objectives.
    This is a feature being worked into newer quests and areas, and a feature that is being retroactively added to existing areas in a slow, but eventual process.
  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spotMember Posts: 4,317 Transcendent
  • EnyalidaEnyalida Nasty Woman Member Posts: 4,384 Transcendent
    Yeah, that will be really cool, especially if it allows you to achieve the same result with keywords... just with the keywords made obvious in the choices. That way, you can work the keywords into your own sentences, instead of using the pre-written ones.
  • CaerlyrCaerlyr Member Posts: 282 Capable
    Pretty much just reiterating stuff here, but why in gods name is CGT -disabled- as default for newbies? o.O
  • IsuneIsune Gods Posts: 438 Divine
    Enyalida said:
    Yeah, that will be really cool, especially if it allows you to achieve the same result with keywords... just with the keywords made obvious in the choices. That way, you can work the keywords into your own sentences, instead of using the pre-written ones.
    This should be possible.
  • ShaddusShaddus His Imperial Altness Outside your window.Member Posts: 7,652 Transcendent
    Would the admin ponder allowing newbies to pick between the old intro and the new one, maybe something like CONFIG NEWINTRO OFF?
    If I'm not good enough for Lusternia, then it is no longer good enough for me.
  • RialormRialorm Member Posts: 1,055 Transcendent
    Shaddus said:
    Would the admin ponder allowing newbies to pick between the old intro and the new one, maybe something like CONFIG NEWINTRO OFF?
    That will only add to the confusion of true newbies. I'd rather see the concerns about the new intro addressed.
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  • AllyrianneAllyrianne Member Posts: 334 Expert
    I have to say I am now completely baffled as to when novices get access to what channel, and where the best place to speak to them will be. (I do appreciate that guilds are now notified when novices join, however I received the notification before the "person has stepped out of the portal of fate" message showed up, which I think means that they wouldn't have been able to hear me. Although this may also mean this was someone's testing alt?)

    I should say that a couple of people I've been trying to get to try Lusternia have found the new intro a lot easier and more helpful than the old intro.
  • EveriineEveriine Wise Old Swordsbird / Brontaur Three Lakes, WIMember Posts: 2,762 Transcendent
    Most of us are baffled--the newbie notification messages, the coming through the portal, appearing on CGWHO, appearing on CWHO and being able to use the appropriate channels all happen at different times, especially if a novice does things in different order, and we as other players have no way of knowing if they exist.
    Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"

    Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.

    Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
  • RamiRami Member Posts: 34 Capable
    I have to agree and say that this new intro is way too complicated. True newbies are more likely to just give up on it than worry with trying to wade through it all. Even as an IRE veteran I had to ask poor Skein numerous questions. 

    The whole system seriously needs to be simplified.  
  • IeptixIeptix Member, Moderator, Gods Posts: 819 Divine
    Regarding the intro: having the intro happen in the "live" game is an IRE mandate - it's happening across all the games so far as I know, and is not a thing that is going to go away. I believe the use of MXP and such is also an IRE thing. And no, we cannot offer the old tour parallel to the new one.

    That said, we are aware of the problems with the intro, and I promise that work's being done on that front.

    As for the issue with org visibilities, channels, and whatnot, I'll look into simplifying and unifying and sensifying the whats and whens and such as I work on the tour.
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  • ShaddusShaddus His Imperial Altness Outside your window.Member Posts: 7,652 Transcendent
    You should hire some mortal to work with you. You know, maybe some guy that had rolled a lot of novices, been in all of the guilds, and loves to help out.

    Heck, he'd probably help for the sheer joy of doing so, if you asked him.
    If I'm not good enough for Lusternia, then it is no longer good enough for me.
  • AnnickAnnick Member Posts: 234 Adept
    Shaddus said:

    You should hire some mortal to work with you. You know, maybe some guy that had rolled a lot of novices, been in all of the guilds, and loves to help out.

    Heck, he'd probably help for the sheer joy of doing so, if you asked him.

    Why are you volunteering me?
  • EveriineEveriine Wise Old Swordsbird / Brontaur Three Lakes, WIMember Posts: 2,762 Transcendent
    Why am I not surprised that our problems are the result of a corporate mandate?

    Anyway, I like the idea of Live intro. Get the newbies involved with other players early and in an orderly fashion while introducing them to the basic concepts and commands. I dislike the current structure and utter brokenness of our Live intro, as it accomplishes none of those things, as has been well-documented in this and past threads.
    Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"

    Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.

    Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
  • LeradLerad Member Posts: 2,399 Transcendent
    I don't actually mind the current intro - it just needs a few things fixed.

    The ability to turn off the fate guides is definitely one. Once GUIDE DISMISS is entered, the fate guides shouldn't appear again, at login or whatever. Alternatively, turning the fate guides into actual hints instead of chatterboxes will be great too. The main problem is that they are too invasive, and excludes actual players who want to do the guiding. The fate guides should be something the newbie falls back on when there is no player (either online, or just free enough) to help them. So make a command called GUIDE HELP and make it give a walkthrough-step about how to complete whichever collegium quest the newbie is on.

    The shadow killing thing is too cliche and buggy. Wipe that out, and turn it into "kill a fink". It serves the exact same purpose.

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