RP? Murdering villagers because there are no consequences

Shikha

Didn't find a log section, so feel free to move this if I'm just totally blind:

(Magnagora): A village woman says, "Someone help me! Please!"
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "Uh."
(Magnagora): Lavinya says, "Disregard this."
(Magnagora): Marcella (from the Astral Plane) says, "Which village is that?"
(Magnagora): Marcella (from the Astral Plane) says, "Ah."
(Magnagora): Lavinya says, "It will be over in a moment."
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "Why."
(Magnagora): A village man says, "I'm in trouble here at Stewarts Road!"
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "Why'd you kill it."
(Magnagora): Marcella (from the Astral Plane) says, "What are you people doing."
(Magnagora): A village man says, "I'm in trouble here at Stewarts Road!"
(Magnagora): You say, "Sounds like we are killing loyal villagers to make a coat."
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "Oh."
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "I approve."
(Magnagora): Mirazel says, "And done."
(Magnagora): You say, "I do not."
(Magnagora): You say, "That is despicable."
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "We've killed citizens for less."
(Magnagora): You say, "Would we kill Morgfyre's gentlemen to make a hat?"
(Magnagora): Lavinya says, "And I allowed it. You may of course take your complaint to the Warlord, Supervisor."
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "I would."
(Magnagora): You say, "Or the Demon Lords for a cute jacket?"
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "Sounds like a good idea to me."
(Magnagora): Marcella (from the Astral Plane) says, "Maybe some demons."
(Magnagora): Ilthilior (from the Astral Plane) says, "That would have to be one badass jacket."
(Magnagora): You say, "Sure would, all the more reason to get on it."
(Magnagora): Ilthilior (from the Astral Plane) says, "Though, I don't really approve of it."
(Magnagora): Silvanus says, "Comparing a Demon Lord to a pathetic human from Stewartsville that'll switch his allegiance as soon as he can is the true crime her."
(Magnagora): Silvanus says, "Here."
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "I have low standards."
(Magnagora): You say, "A pathetic human from stewartsville who has pledged their life as a cog of the engine?"
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "Did they actually."
(Magnagora): Ilthilior (from the Astral Plane) says, "Totally not worth a jacket, honestly."
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "Or did their leaders."
(Magnagora): Mirazel (from the Aetherways) says, "Villagers in general change their loyalties like some change clothes with the seasons."
(Magnagora): Silvanus says, "We have seen them switch their allegiances often in the past, they only follow us because we demaned their surrender."
(Magnagora): You say, "So I may kill our villagers with impunity??"
(Magnagora): Silvanus says, "When you convince villagers, have you noticed what you are telling them?"
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "Sure."
(Magnagora): Silvanus says, "Tales of terror to shock those who reject us."
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "Kill citizens too."
(Magnagora): Silvanus says, "Promises of power to inspire awe."
(Magnagora): Lavinya says, "You can ask permission of the council, just as Mirazel did."
(Magnagora): You say, "Tales of terror lose their potency when you kill everyone anyways."
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "I disagree."
(Magnagora): Mirazel (from the Aetherways) says, "It is good to remind those who fear you, why they should fear you."
(Magnagora): Lavinya says, "I imagine it gives the tales some credence."
(Magnagora): Munsia (from the Astral Plane) says, "I like to believe I'm a horror story for little children in Celest."
(Magnagora): Silvanus says, "I suppose we could kidnap them and send them to the i'Xiia madhouse. That might help."
(Magnagora): Marcella (from the Astral Plane) says, "But would they get along with the mugwump ethnicity there?"
(Magnagora): Silvanus says, "Does anyone get along with the i'Xiia?"
(Magnagora): Marcella (from the Astral Plane) says, "N'Lochli."
(Magnagora): Silvanus says, "Then why are you asking me that question, you should just answer it."

2014/05/23 03:48:21 - Mirazel has been declared a formal enemy for slaying a village woman.
2014/05/23 03:49:48 - Lavinya declared that Mirazel is no longer an enemy. Reason: Fashion is important.

You read what is written on creamy light beige stationery:
Warlord,

It is with extreme regret that I burden you, so shortly after my return
to wakefulness, with such trouble. I wish to bring to your attention the
inappropriate conduct, as defined in CHELP LAWSI, A III Inappropriate
Conduct. As an action that a reasonable person would consider likely to
erode confidence in the integrity of the government of Magnagora, but
which does not violate any identifiable directive, rule, statute, or
other standard applicable to Magnagora. Mirazel, with the aide of
Lavinya slew loyal subjects of the Engine, protected residents of our
loyal village Stewartsville for no reason other than personal gain.

It is my argument that the destruction of those who swear the allegiance
to the Engine without cause damages the integrity of the Engine and our
ability to promise protection in the future to those who would
capitulate to our demands. It damages our ability to promise protection
to our loyal citizens, as it is obvious that we would turn on any of our
subjects if we suddenly fancied their skin for a suit. These are not
merian or elves, we speak of, but human villagers under our protection,
working for our benefit.

While I hold great respect for the parties involved, I feel that it is
extremely inappropriate for such conduct to go without notice or
reprimand, as it is harmful to the reputation, and thus the power, of
the Engine as a whole.

With Deepest Regrets,
Shikha

Belibi

lol?

Marcella

the log section is "Event Scrolls"

Vivet

I seem to remember this one time that the admin made Stewartsville revolt because Serenwilde (the liege at the time) took to killing the baby over and over again, because it was "necessary" to prevent it from being a sacrifice for Crow.

It's fine RP. Whether or not it is RP that might have an eventual consequence is another matter!

Munsia

I was trolling mostly, but posting an entire log of Mag's city aether on the forums seem's outside of decorum >_>

Eodh

Far, far worse things have been posted on the forums, though.

Rialorm

I can see where either side comes from. One the one hand villages are fickle creatures that keep changing their minds, so killing a few might actually strike some fear into their hearts. On the other hand once pledged to Magnagora they are part of the Engine so you're basically killing 'Engine property' which goes against the org. 

If the question is if this is an RP log, I'd say yes. Sure it might seem inconsequential to slay a few villagers but it really is not. I think this is some interesting internal conflict of oppinion for Magnagora to deal with

Shikha

Munsia said:

I was trolling mostly, but posting an entire log of Mag's city aether on the forums seem's outside of decorum >_>

This can't be outside of decorum because this is an OOC discussion on a magical computer system that doesn't exist in Lusternia.

Maligorn

I feel like this log is totally in line with Magnagora being evil. "Fashion is important" made me chuckle, because Magnagora is meant to be full of aristocrats that gleefully abuse their subjects. Really not seeing the issue here, unless it chafes the ideal that Magnagora are the holy ones and Celest is unholy, a la evil, clawing angels and humble, noble demons in the Cathedral.

However, might consider changing government style to Despotic Conquest, since Benign isn't really what I'd call this.

Leolamins

Lucky I am away for the weekend. Time for another beer while I ponder this.

Lavinya

why would you bring this to the forums? is this an attempt to get mob justice because you didn't like the in game response? it's roleplay. also, i didn't help it. roleplay is more fun when it's the game, not when it's influenced by outside opinions from other players of how we should have rped. just a game, folks! no real humans were harmed in the pursuit of fashion.

Cyndarin

The amount of trolling on Mag CT is kind of depressing.

 

I would say it fits the modern Mag narrative to use and enslave villages, and murder them on occassion to scare them into fealty. I suppose the bigger question is should Mag RP be the stereotypical evil that it is.

 

The days of village consequences are gone. The admin tried it once with Stewarts and the affected players threw a massive fit. Since then, when players have followed suit and murdered villagers over and over, like we saw with Celest in Ankgrag, the village RP is just rewritten to suit the situation. It's just smoothed over with an event.

Cyndarin

False memory this post.

Shikha

Not everyone RP's mag being "evil". If you believe Celest's RP is about being "good" (relative terms here) or benevolent, then I will say you are wrong. Celest has done some pretty crazy bad stuff in the name of their crusade.

@Lavinya I'm not seeking forum or admin intervention with this post. I posted it because it made me LOL that this is apparently a thing now and nobody cares. Shikha sent a letter to Leo; in game resolution is being sought for this conflict. I also don't consider killing the villagers roleplay, but gaming mechanics. The only reason any real roleplay will actually come from this is because I decided Shikha kicking up some dust over the indiscriminate slaying of innocent villagers who had sworn fealty to the engine is absolutely what she would have done. Especially since the comms people were after could have been gotten elsewhere.

Edited to avoid double posting.

Cyndarin

Well I'm not saying I it should or shouldn't be, or that every player RPs the same perspective of Mag. I'm merely saying that the posted discussion was very stereotypical "evil mag" kill them all style RP.

 

So to asnwer the question, yes. It is RP. The question I posed was, I think, what you're really asking. SHOULD that be Mag's RP?

 

To which I did not answer yes or no, so people can stop disagreeing with me.

Moi

Magnagora has a sort of dichotomy going on. There's one view where the city should spread the Taint and rule over the Basin as an end unto itself. More Taint is a good thing on its own merits. And there's another view where spreading the Taint is a means to an end. More Taint is a good thing because it means more money, more power and more slaves. From that first perspective, Lavinya ordering a villager flayed to make a coat is a horrifying abuse of power. But from that second perspective, being allowed to order people killed for your own amusement was the entire point of getting power in the first place.While I think they're both valid ways to RP Magnagora, they're obviously going to come into conflict.

Shikha

@Celina my good/evil comment was for Maligorn, but distractions caused me to take my time hitting post :P

Turnus

It might not be against forum rules, but I think it's bad form to post a log of an event/something while at the same time going after IC resolution of some sort. Let the IG stuff happen first, then post all about it once it's done.

Lavinya

as a side note, where can you find humans outside ofvillages? Mirazel asked and no one knew of anywhere. That's how she came to ask about doing it in the first place. Is there somewhere?

Siam

Aren't the scholars/bards humans?

Shikha

I want to say Duum has humans. There are also villages with humans that belong to mag enemies.

@Turnus that's your opinion. What gets discussed here will have no bearing on how I play my character, and I trust Leo and Lavi not to metagame either.

Tridemon

Sure- Trader Bob and Cle Lenaue come to mind, offhand... and I think perhaps Quillion Jones and Adalgiso, too. Oh, and Lars Legrand, definitely.

Karlach

What race are the Shallamurine Priestesses?

Vivet

Pretty sure May and Kipp in the Moors are human too, no? As well as that one waystation chef, Joric.

Tridemon

The Shallamurine priestesses definitely aren't human- humans only showed up with Estarra, and the Shallamurine priestesses were turned at the beginning of the Taint Wars. I think they're Merian, Orclach, and Krokani... Could be wrong, though.

Eritheyl

The waiters and patrons in Chez Magnifique and Bistro Noir read as humans, but unfortunately they're just raceless filler for the moment.

...hey, @Estarra.

Rialorm

Siam said:

Aren't the scholars/bards humans?

Pilgrims are various races. I honestly don't know about bards and scholars. I never really looked at them for all the many I've gathered, haha.

Shikha

They don't explicitly say.

Mentally I picture them as human, but that's mostly because of being human IRL I default to imagine everything that isn't stated as something else as human. Realistically, I would think they would be a random smattering of races, like the pilgrims, except there should totes be human pilgrims and there aren't.

Belibi

Shikha said:

Realistically, I would think they would be a random smattering of races, like the pilgrims, except there should totes be human pilgrims and there aren't.

Humans weren't around when the last vernal gods became Avechna. Guess they cbf to make a pilgrimage.

Brona

I really hate the whole "mag is evil" crap.  My character genuinely believes that Magnagora is the true path to victory over the Soulless and the other cities / Divine (not associated with the 12) are weaker in comparison.  However, Brona does believe in certain things like laws and proper behavior from the citizens of the Empire which seem to be less important to some these days.

Ileein

Well, I certainly think that most villains are far more compelling if they believe themselves to be heroes. Cackling, mustachio-twirling, cape-fluttering villains are easy; humans who sincerely think they are right and you are wrong are hard, and can be oh so scary. Despite that, I think it's hard to claim that Magnagora doesn't occupy a role in the Lusternian fiction that doesn't qualify as even slightly villainous. The degree to which that is played out beyond the aesthetic, of course, is up to its players.