So when you said you did natal charts, you didn't mean you draw them up, I'm guessing? Because as someone who charges extra to have me draw the chart by hand (ow) and calculate out the positions, etc, from an ephemeris, I would hope you not take that pain upon yourself.
I did!
Crumkane, Lord of Epicurean Delights says, "WAS IT INDEED ON FIRE, ERITHEYL."
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With a deep reverb, Contemptible Sutekh says, "CEASE YOUR INFERNAL ENERGY, ERITHEYL."
So when you said you did natal charts, you didn't mean you draw them up, I'm guessing? Because as someone who charges extra to have me draw the chart by hand (ow) and calculate out the positions, etc, from an ephemeris, I would hope you not take that pain upon yourself.
So when you said you did natal charts, you didn't mean you draw them up, I'm guessing? Because as someone who charges extra to have me draw the chart by hand (ow) and calculate out the positions, etc, from an ephemeris, I would hope you not take that pain upon yourself.
I did!
Gods bless your soul.
And wrist.
I've only ever had one natal chart done, and it was a free site that didn't really care about the hour of birth, and only very loosely about the place (I tried it with cities miles apart and got the same results) that also made broad, sweeping assumptions that were often contradictory from one section to the next (I recall specifically that I was outgoing, but a loner, and that I took charge often but preferred to remain on the sidelines. I took these to mean that it apparently thinks I am an evil genius. Or Batman.)
Why do people willingly subject themselves to believing that some higher force rules them? Yes, things happen outside of your control but ultimately at the core of your being it is you that governs your reaction to it. It seems to me almost dangerous to go and believe you cannot change something about that, or that you do not possess this power. It's also easy to place 'the blame' on something outside of yourself. And a lot of people really don't want to hear that they are choosing to be angry at person X who did bad thing Y. But that's actually how it is. Feelings are choices for a larger part, but if you acknowledge that you also acknowledge responsibility for this choice, and it's there many take a step back because they don't want that. Never mind that choosing to be angry doesn't suddenly make you a bad person, it means you are human. But if you have that realization it does mean you can shape your future reactions. The same goes for sadness, you make a choice to be so. Sure, some of it happens automatically, and in some cases you should even opt for it (properly grieving for a lost loved one for example). But you being sad because someone said so and so, that's a choice. That's you letting their actions affect you.
Honestly, if you are feeling blue this time of year, it's probably because you are in the northern hemisphere where it is winter and you are not getting enough hours of daylight and the bad weather is not helping it either. And if that lasts for a while, or becomes something that stands in your way, you are far better off to find some medical help for that. Depression isn't a joke. Nor is someone believe it is some planet alignment crushing their very spirit while it is actually something like an hormonal imbalance doing that.
And if you are suddenly seeing patterns, it's probably a cognitive bias such as confirmation bias. A vague enough statement such as "everyone will suddenly appear crazy" is very easy to find 'proof' for because it is so broad. If I tell you everyone in the coming week will seem very happy, and you believe in that, it will seem like that to you because your brain is very good at picking up things that match that statement and filtering out the rest. Our minds are really very weird at times. Which is fascinating to learn about, because you gain a certain humbleness in knowing how 'stupid' you really are. It's also useful to know so you can catch others, or yourself, on it. The latter which is the hardest of all, because your brain is like constantly lying and making up stuff because that how it works. Extremely clever from an evolutionary perspective, because your mind making up things where there are gaps is more useful than doing nothing, as it may actually get it somewhat right. But yes, something to be careful about too.
You have received a new honour! Congratulations! On this day, you have shown your willingness to ensure a bug-free Lusternia for everyone to enjoy. The face of Iosai the Anomaly unfolds before you, and within you grows the knowledge that you have earned the elusive and rare honour of membership in Her Order. Curio Exchange - A website to help with the trading of curio pieces in Lusternia.
Essentially, you have what is called a locus of control, which is where you assign blame/credit for certain things. This can be an internal locus, meaning you assign the notion of control to yourself as Rialorn is suggesting, or external, meaning you assign the notion of control to other people or events outside your control. A point brought up by one of my classmates is that there ARE things that are 100% out of your control, such as the weather, and others that are essentially 100% in your control, such as where and how you spend your discretionary income, and some things that are a combination of the two, such as how much sleep you get in a given night.
Having an external locus of control allows one to relax about a subject or event because, after all, it's not something you can control. Having an internal locus of control allows you to take agency for mistakes or accomplishments, and thereby improve your skills or actions in that area.
Point well taken, @Rialorm. I cannot say whether I fully invest belief in anything, truly. Even evolution is still a theory, which has as many gaps and holes as the dreaded "r" word - something I dare not write on these forums (and please, do not take this as an invitation to go there - that is a topic for another thread).
Also note that Mercury doesn't retrograde at the same times every year, but I do yield to your point about seasonal affective disorder. Winter makes people lethargic and, perhaps, a little more on the depressed side of the emotional spectrum without their daily doses of vitamin D. Especially where I live, in New England. The sun is missing, alas.
However, rather than looking at this thread as a chance for sacrosanct introspection, let's move forward with what it was supposed to be in the first place: a judgment free, whimsical thread where we can use Mercury as a scapegoat for the crummy things that may or may not have happened anyway, regardless of planetary alignment.
For example, I got a text from my boss asking me where 5 extremely expensive pieces of technology were, which I was responsible for. In my blind panic, I only exacerbated the problem by making it sound like I didn't really care that they were missing (I'm off today, and couldn't have looked for them if I wanted to). So that accounts for two of the core components of Mercury retrograde: technology chaos and miscommunication. Dun dun dun.
@Rialorm - if someone believes anything about themselves or the world is set in stone, it's important to stop them right away. I certainly do.
Yes, I do astrological reports. What are they meant to give, to show?
Insight
The way things could go
The way things might have gone
There are a billion billion things that can influence the way things occur or don't occur, and the great thing is yes, we have free will, it is in our power to change our course of action and of life.
If I do a natal report for someone and they read that they're someone who's shy and standoffish, does it mean they actually are? No. It means that typically, someone born on this day at this time is like that. But anything can influence that. If that someone is actually shy and standoffish, does it mean they're going to be like that forever? No. In fact, they could decide at that exact moment, "That's not the person I want to be" and work on it and change it.
I'll be the first to stop a person if they say to me when I'm giving them an astrological report or going over it with them, "I can't believe that this happened to me and that this will happen to me, and--" No. No it's not guarantee. It's a correlation, not a causation, and it's not guarantee. It never is. It does get really tedious to put "may" and "might" and "maybe" every other word for an astrological report. It's typically considered "this is what things will default to if you don't actively work against it."
Your fate is in your hands; the only thing astrological charts and reports will ever do is tell you things to look out for in yourself and in your life.
Any subject that requires belief or faith over pure scientific fact is going to attract both skeptics and believers. I find it interesting to note that mentioning religion is considered more taboo than discussing astrology, for example! Each to their own beliefs, and if one type isn't up for discussion, then none should be, really - each one is likely to stir hot debate on either side. I don't believe in astrology, but I respect other people their right to. I don't think it's mine or anyone else's place on these forums to ridicule or marginalise that belief, no matter how right you think you are or how wrong you think that belief is.
(Ideally people can not believe or believe without feeling the need to convince each other that they're wrong for their stance, but let's face it, that's never going to happen. Maybe topics of this nature as well as that forbidden 'r' word should be equally avoided on the forums.)
However, rather than looking at this thread as a chance for sacrosanct introspection, let's move forward with what it was supposed to be in the first place: a judgment free, whimsical thread where we can use Mercury as a scapegoat for the crummy things that may or may not have happened anyway, regardless of planetary alignment.
For example, I got a text from my boss asking me where 5 extremely expensive pieces of technology were, which I was responsible for. In my blind panic, I only exacerbated the problem by making it sound like I didn't really care that they were missing (I'm off today, and couldn't have looked for them if I wanted to). So that accounts for two of the core components of Mercury retrograde: technology chaos and miscommunication. Dun dun dun.
My dad broke my mouse this morning. I complained about this on the GD thread. I'm using an old mouse. So old. So very old. It never clicks where I want it to, and the clicking doesn't always work. Teers.
I also think people should believe whatever makes them happy and comfortable, because ultimately that's all that matters.
Thank you for that. I knew I was bound to make some people upset, hence I nearly didn't post. But I also know this forum is a place where we can discuss things and respectfully disagree. I probably could have worded myself a little less strongly. There's personal stuff mixed into why I am a strong believer of free will and feel a sense of worry when people go into denial about this. I do in the end think Daraius is right though, if a belief makes you happy then that is a good thing. I'm more concerned about when beliefs make people unhappy. Beliefs can be very strong, this is in part why placebos work, and this is something that has science baffled. I'm not one to say that they should be banned because they clearly have an effect and if that effect cures someone or gives them relief, that is a great thing indeed. I used to think homoeopathy was a horrible scam because it scientifically cannot work, but it actually seems to be helping quite a few people. So long as such treatments don't rob a person blind I am willing to be neutral about them. Although in some cases the price actually affects the effectiveness. Yep, brains are weird things. Anyway, I feel we can find common grounds here. I don't intend to offend.
@Aetoran: Never knew about that being an actual thing in psychology. Happy to have learned something new. I think it is very interesting how all these things overlap.
@Lisaera: Thanks for letting me say my part. I'll let the thread go back to the intended topic.
@Selenity: You actually did some of that for me. And I agree, it can get you to think about yourself (it did for me) and that is good. I think you've got a great attitude about it. You were honestly one of the people I was concerned of pissing off a bit, because I do consider you my friend. So glad that didn't happen!
You have received a new honour! Congratulations! On this day, you have shown your willingness to ensure a bug-free Lusternia for everyone to enjoy. The face of Iosai the Anomaly unfolds before you, and within you grows the knowledge that you have earned the elusive and rare honour of membership in Her Order. Curio Exchange - A website to help with the trading of curio pieces in Lusternia.
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EveriineWise Old Swordsbird / BrontaurIndianapolis, IN, USA
This is sort of how I felt when I had to do an honest-to-goodness MBTI inventory and the Enneagram. According to them, my inclination is to someone who is slightly introverted, who takes in information through sensing, who feels his way through decisions, and who pays attentions to details; but also someone who is loyal, enjoys getting support, but who is afraid of lots of things.
It helped when I finally understood that all of these are just tendencies--they are how I generally react when push comes to shove. But, they do not mandate how I act or react, and being aware of these tendencies is helpful.
Of course, that assumes that one places their trust in such personality indicators.
Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"
Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.
Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
Honestly, I struggle with it. My mom recently got into healing crystals and aura reading, and may or may not believe she's an actual witch. My grandma cites being "made in God's image" as a reason for trying to stay healthy. I have a first instinct for sarcasm and dismissiveness that I try really hard to censor, because even if I think everyone around me is full of bullshit, I'm just as irrational as everyone else, and definitely not as smart as I like to think I am. For instance, one thing that keeps me out of a spiral of existential anxiety is pretending that I'll get to live forever as part of the machine consciousness that inevitably overtakes this planet. I honestly can't say whether I actually believe that or even want to, but it's about as plausible an afterlife as any other I've heard of. I put about as much faith in it as I do astrology, or Myers-Briggs, but it lets my brain make a tic mark in a box and move on to other thoughts.
Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
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EveriineWise Old Swordsbird / BrontaurIndianapolis, IN, USA
Hehe, I'm the crazy one--I'm the seminary-trained, ordained pastor here.
Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"
Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.
Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
Heh, I'm a somewhat genderfluid gay polyamourous furry attending online classes in a private Christian college. I might have met your crazy and raised you one.
Generally I playfully dig into people that mention Astrology because I really enjoy the study of Astronomy. But the truth is is that Astrology is the before-Astronomy that people used to conduct their lives until science told them otherwise.
Secretly I enjoy things like tarot card readings, natal charts and other occult things. It's just another, intriguing part of life -- something to be enjoyed. But never taken -too- seriously -- as with anything you engage in.
This is sort of how I felt when I had to do an honest-to-goodness MBTI inventory and the Enneagram.
Interesting you brought that up. They have more scientific grounds, in that you answer questions rather than looking at how the planets were aligned when you were born, but you are right they are not a set in stone and valid for every situation thing. They're also a snapshot of that time, and ideally you need to take the tests several times. Certain life events can also change it rapidly. And each letter is in fact a scale, so that aspect is important too. You scored a little bit introvert, I scored far more. I'm an INFJ, btw.
Also, would like to add that introversion is often still misunderstood. It doesn't mean you are shy or just not social, though some introverts certainly are. It relates to energy. Introverts deplete their energy when around people and need to hole up on their own to recover from that. Extroverts on the other hand need to surround themselves with people to get their energy back. And they are not automatically super social and loud people.
You have received a new honour! Congratulations! On this day, you have shown your willingness to ensure a bug-free Lusternia for everyone to enjoy. The face of Iosai the Anomaly unfolds before you, and within you grows the knowledge that you have earned the elusive and rare honour of membership in Her Order. Curio Exchange - A website to help with the trading of curio pieces in Lusternia.
This is sort of how I felt when I had to do an honest-to-goodness MBTI inventory and the Enneagram.
Interesting you brought that up. They have more scientific grounds, in that you answer questions rather than looking at how the planets were aligned when you were born, but you are right they are not a set in stone and valid for every situation thing. They're also a snapshot of that time, and ideally you need to take the tests several times. Certain life events can also change it rapidly. And each letter is in fact a scale, so that aspect is important too. You scored a little bit introvert, I scored far more. I'm an INFJ, btw.
Also, would like to add that introversion is often still misunderstood. It doesn't mean you are shy or just not social, though some introverts certainly are. It relates to energy. Introverts deplete their energy when around people and need to hole up on their own to recover from that. Extroverts on the other hand need to surround themselves with people to get their energy back. And they are not automatically super social and loud people.
Yep, I scored barely on the introvert side--people usually can't tell that I'm an introvert. But I know that, at the end of a long week, I just want to lock myself in a room all alone with a computer and hot chocolate and let the world outside burn while I recharge. I remember scoring pretty far on the N and F side, and not so far on the J side. Part of taking these tests during Candidacy included day-long retreats where we studied what they were and what they actually told us.
And while the MTBI especially is more scientifically grounded, I am hearing more and more that it is not held up in as high regard as it once was.
Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"
Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.
Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
The climate might have changed by now, but while I was getting my degree the Big 5/OCEAN scale was in vogue. It measures personality across five axes: openness, conscientiousness, extraversion, agreeableness, and neuroticism. It was considered such a golden metric because it was supposedly more predictive of actual behavior than Myers-Briggs or any inventory. It's pretty neat, but I don't know if it's still the golden standard.
Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
1
EveriineWise Old Swordsbird / BrontaurIndianapolis, IN, USA
Huh... never heard of that one. Then again, I hadn't heard of the Enneagram either, and don't understand it very well aside from the basics.
Everiine is a man, and is very manly. This MAN before you is so manly you might as well just gender bend right now, cause he's the manliest man that you ever did see. His manly shape has spurned many women and girlyer men to boughs of fainting. He stands before you in a manly manerific typical man-like outfit which is covered in his manly motto: "I am a man!"
Daraius said: You gotta risk it for the biscuit.
Pony power all the way, yo. The more Brontaurs the better.
Who gets grumpy when they get a reminder call for their meds being refilled after they declined to authorise the doctor's office to reorder for them? And then gets snippy with the poor guy trying to fill it?
I actually had the nurse apologise for her immediately after she found out who's meds I was calling about.
The climate might have changed by now, but while I was getting my degree the Big 5/OCEAN scale was in vogue. It measures personality across five axes: openness, conscientiousness, extraversion, agreeableness, and neuroticism. It was considered such a golden metric because it was supposedly more predictive of actual behavior than Myers-Briggs or any inventory. It's pretty neat, but I don't know if it's still the golden standard.b
The climate might have changed by now, but while I was getting my degree the Big 5/OCEAN scale was in vogue. It measures personality across five axes: openness, conscientiousness, extraversion, agreeableness, and neuroticism. It was considered such a golden metric because it was supposedly more predictive of actual behavior than Myers-Briggs or any inventory. It's pretty neat, but I don't know if it's still the golden standard.b
Comments
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Honestly, if you are feeling blue this time of year, it's probably because you are in the northern hemisphere where it is winter and you are not getting enough hours of daylight and the bad weather is not helping it either. And if that lasts for a while, or becomes something that stands in your way, you are far better off to find some medical help for that. Depression isn't a joke. Nor is someone believe it is some planet alignment crushing their very spirit while it is actually something like an hormonal imbalance doing that.
And if you are suddenly seeing patterns, it's probably a cognitive bias such as confirmation bias. A vague enough statement such as "everyone will suddenly appear crazy" is very easy to find 'proof' for because it is so broad. If I tell you everyone in the coming week will seem very happy, and you believe in that, it will seem like that to you because your brain is very good at picking up things that match that statement and filtering out the rest. Our minds are really very weird at times. Which is fascinating to learn about, because you gain a certain humbleness in knowing how 'stupid' you really are. It's also useful to know so you can catch others, or yourself, on it. The latter which is the hardest of all, because your brain is like constantly lying and making up stuff because that how it works. Extremely clever from an evolutionary perspective, because your mind making up things where there are gaps is more useful than doing nothing, as it may actually get it somewhat right. But yes, something to be careful about too.
You have received a new honour! Congratulations! On this day, you have shown your willingness to ensure a bug-free Lusternia for everyone to enjoy. The face of Iosai the Anomaly unfolds before you, and within you grows the knowledge that you have earned the elusive and rare honour of membership in Her Order.
Curio Exchange - A website to help with the trading of curio pieces in Lusternia.
http://psychology.about.com/od/personalitydevelopment/fl/What-Is-Locus-of-Control.htm
Essentially, you have what is called a locus of control, which is where you assign blame/credit for certain things. This can be an internal locus, meaning you assign the notion of control to yourself as Rialorn is suggesting, or external, meaning you assign the notion of control to other people or events outside your control. A point brought up by one of my classmates is that there ARE things that are 100% out of your control, such as the weather, and others that are essentially 100% in your control, such as where and how you spend your discretionary income, and some things that are a combination of the two, such as how much sleep you get in a given night.
Having an external locus of control allows one to relax about a subject or event because, after all, it's not something you can control. Having an internal locus of control allows you to take agency for mistakes or accomplishments, and thereby improve your skills or actions in that area.
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(Ideally people can not believe or believe without feeling the need to convince each other that they're wrong for their stance, but let's face it, that's never going to happen. Maybe topics of this nature as well as that forbidden 'r' word should be equally avoided on the forums.)
Thank you for that. I knew I was bound to make some people upset, hence I nearly didn't post. But I also know this forum is a place where we can discuss things and respectfully disagree. I probably could have worded myself a little less strongly. There's personal stuff mixed into why I am a strong believer of free will and feel a sense of worry when people go into denial about this. I do in the end think Daraius is right though, if a belief makes you happy then that is a good thing. I'm more concerned about when beliefs make people unhappy. Beliefs can be very strong, this is in part why placebos work, and this is something that has science baffled. I'm not one to say that they should be banned because they clearly have an effect and if that effect cures someone or gives them relief, that is a great thing indeed. I used to think homoeopathy was a horrible scam because it scientifically cannot work, but it actually seems to be helping quite a few people. So long as such treatments don't rob a person blind I am willing to be neutral about them. Although in some cases the price actually affects the effectiveness. Yep, brains are weird things. Anyway, I feel we can find common grounds here. I don't intend to offend.
@Aetoran: Never knew about that being an actual thing in psychology. Happy to have learned something new. I think it is very interesting how all these things overlap.
@Lisaera: Thanks for letting me say my part. I'll let the thread go back to the intended topic.
@Selenity: You actually did some of that for me. And I agree, it can get you to think about yourself (it did for me) and that is good. I think you've got a great attitude about it. You were honestly one of the people I was concerned of pissing off a bit, because I do consider you my friend. So glad that didn't happen!
You have received a new honour! Congratulations! On this day, you have shown your willingness to ensure a bug-free Lusternia for everyone to enjoy. The face of Iosai the Anomaly unfolds before you, and within you grows the knowledge that you have earned the elusive and rare honour of membership in Her Order.
Curio Exchange - A website to help with the trading of curio pieces in Lusternia.
It helped when I finally understood that all of these are just tendencies--they are how I generally react when push comes to shove. But, they do not mandate how I act or react, and being aware of these tendencies is helpful.
Of course, that assumes that one places their trust in such personality indicators.
Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
Secretly I enjoy things like tarot card readings, natal charts and other occult things. It's just another, intriguing part of life -- something to be enjoyed. But never taken -too- seriously -- as with anything you engage in.
Also, would like to add that introversion is often still misunderstood. It doesn't mean you are shy or just not social, though some introverts certainly are. It relates to energy. Introverts deplete their energy when around people and need to hole up on their own to recover from that. Extroverts on the other hand need to surround themselves with people to get their energy back. And they are not automatically super social and loud people.
You have received a new honour! Congratulations! On this day, you have shown your willingness to ensure a bug-free Lusternia for everyone to enjoy. The face of Iosai the Anomaly unfolds before you, and within you grows the knowledge that you have earned the elusive and rare honour of membership in Her Order.
Curio Exchange - A website to help with the trading of curio pieces in Lusternia.
And while the MTBI especially is more scientifically grounded, I am hearing more and more that it is not held up in as high regard as it once was.
Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
Big 5 is still in, it's useful for some things.
I'm a O53-C21-E7-A32-N80 Big Five!!
Forgiveness is the fragrance that the violet sheds on the heel that has crushed it.
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