Lack of Raves VI: Rave Today, Tweet Tomorrow



  • Yasei  野生Yasei 野生 Member Posts: 74 Capable
    Iron Star is the most powerful ship. Down with Taint Wind
  • RilunaRiluna Member Posts: 1,105 Mythical
    I just went to Glom for reasons that had nothing to do with treachery, backstabbery, deals in the dark, nor any of my other usual shenanigans.

    And it was good. <3 Glom.

    Mayor Steingrim, the Grand Schema says to you, "Well, as I recall you kinda leave a mark whereever you go."
  • DeichtineDeichtine Member Posts: 1,584 Transcendent
    Shaddus said:

    Fine, fine. Here we see Hallifax in the foreground and Magnagora in the background as......

    Thats a much better name :D
  • ChirbiChirbi Member Posts: 148 Capable
    All this player-driven upheaval is so exciting! Everyone keep being trouble makers! For myself, this is probably the most exciting event to happen since I came to Lusty.
  • RidetaRideta Member Posts: 92 Gifted
    I always enjoyed Lusternia a bit more when alliances had the tendency to shift every 8-12 months. Kept things exciting and everyone grounded - Also made for better pvp in the long term.

    Plus, you know, it's easier to ditch the polarization when your allies can become your enemies next month. 

    So yeah, definitely raves for all of this tomfoolery I'm hearing about :D
    (Magnagora): Thax says, "My truest favour to the soldier that brings me the weave of Neos."
  • LysistrataLysistrata Member Posts: 32 Capable
  • YarithYarith Member Posts: 997 Mythical
    Alliances aren't going to switch lul
    (I'm the mom of Hallifax btw, so if you are in Hallifax please call me mom.)

    == Professional Girl Gamer == 
    Yes I play games
    Yes I'm a girl
    get over it
  • KagatoKagato Carmichael, CAMember Posts: 1,227 Mythical
    Yarith said:
    Alliances aren't going to switch lul
    Yes they are.  Glomdoring and Magnagora have officially dissolved their alliances and other stuff is in the works.  Not going to say here though.
    Never put passion before principle.  Even if you win, you lose.

    If olive oil comes from olives, where does baby oil come from?

    If vegetarians eat vegetables, what do humanitarians eat?
  • DeichtineDeichtine Member Posts: 1,584 Transcendent
    edited September 2017
    Too stable alliances are bad in general.

    I kinda think the current alliance system has stifiled PK a fair bit as well. If you are going 3v3 you are limiting your options quite a lot. It's also easy for a 3v3 the way numbers work to get unbalanced really quickly.  Which is what we saw last year where the two biggest orgs were fix linked. More fluid alliances would have allowed them to drop each other and go their own way making more conflict.

    I'm not saying alliances are bad but super fixed never changing alliances are.  For one you lose out on the sweet sweet political roleplay.

    From a purely ooc game play perspective more fluid alliances would let folks create more balanced PK opportunities.

    One of the biggest complaints I heard when I started the game was that the one side has the biggest numbers and there was almost no PK due to fights being heavily one sided. Most villages/domoths had large numbers on one side and a small resistance on the other.

    If we have more fluid alliances we're left in a situation where we can fix that ourselves. Act like the HRE, lets fight amongst outselves a ton and band together when one of us gets too strong. Hate everyone, love no one.

  • FalaeronFalaeron Jolteon Member Posts: 1,663 Transcendent
    edited September 2017
    Ejderha is right. It's all game theory. In an every org for themselves situation, two orgs will eventually decide they hate another org enough to band together to beat them. Not wanting to be left out, the other orgs will then try to find themselves an alliance. We might just go straight back into a 3v3. Even if we don't, and get a 2v2v2 as an example, two of those alliances will decide that they would like to team up and win every time, so it becomes a 4v2 until two of the orgs decide they actually hate each other more, or the godmins step in (yes, they will and have stepped in) and we go back into the 3v3 climate again.

    Also let's be honest. Most of us aren't here to create more balanced PK opportunities, or some skills wouldn't see as much use as they do.
  • DeichtineDeichtine Member Posts: 1,584 Transcendent

    I'll disagree with you there about folks trying to make more balanced pk. There's been tons of fights folks just don't join because the numbers are way out of wack. I don't think you give people enough credit. Most folks want a fun fair playing field.

    Sure there is always going to be one or two like you said who just care about wining instead of having a good competition but the majority of folks want to have fun and understand that requires balancedish numbers.

  • DeichtineDeichtine Member Posts: 1,584 Transcendent
    Also Lusternia has had a 3 way alliance situation that lasted for ages. As have other IRE games. Been there done it and it works.
  • FalaeronFalaeron Jolteon Member Posts: 1,663 Transcendent
    I'm just saying you can't expect players to not form the alliances that will help them win more, just as you can't expect them to not use skills that will help them win more.
  • EjderhaEjderha Member Posts: 175 Gifted
    Past performance is not always an indicator of future success. The whole point of an equilibrium state is that the system settles down in a stable configuration and rarely moves - you can have gradations of stability, and surely 2v2v2 is more stable than most other configurations. That doesn't mean it is as stable as 3v3 just because it has happened and persisted for some time.

    I think the combination of population and high number of zero sum conflict events (villages, domoths, flares) make a three way alliance situation really unlikely. It would accentuate population differences between orgs (less coverage from allies by half on average), put even more burden on raid defenders, and potentially make every "defense" action outnumbered. The largest in game "community" each person is part of would shrink by 1/3 in a game where communities are already small. If you assume a more fluid alliance system, I think you have to assume the decisions would be based on organizational self interest, which would destabilize any system with more than two sides, since more allies (and avoiding being screwed by a 4v2 alliance against you) would always be a stronger position. 

    Example: RP wise, I could imagine Serenwilde going complete isolationist, refusing to work with cities or the Wyrd, yeah? In practice, it would be massively self defeating to have no allies in defense, villages, Domoths, etc. People don't like losing, increasing the chances they org hop, alt, or play something else.
  • IanirIanir Administrator, Moderator Posts: 534 Creator
    Reminder that raves is not tweets.

    On topic: Yay for the new secret feature on a branch today!
    Forum Avatar drawn by our lovely Isune.
  • VersaleanVersalean Member Posts: 964 Mythical
    Congratulations to both the winners!
  • DeichtineDeichtine Member Posts: 1,584 Transcendent
    Bascially winning the domoth fights but not having a demigod to claim. Was fun if a bit frustrating.
  • CyndarinCyndarin used Flamethrower! It was super effective. Member Posts: 4,508 Transcendent
    edited October 2017
    Throwback rave to when it was Glomdoring vs The World. No alliance, all death, murder, and fun. You can expect players to not dogpile until they win. Alliances aren't as inevitable as some people make them out to be. They're just the comfortable status quo.  

    Lose and get your ass kicked sometimes, it's not a big deal. The only time I ever got super annoyed at alliances was when Glom just had non aggression pacts with everyone and bored the crap out of me. 
  • IxionIxion Member Posts: 729 Transcendent
    Raves! Getting back into the swing of things has been interesting... politics and drama reminiscent of older times... Anyway, thanks Oneiroi for turning the new Duum quests into honours quests!

    #165 He has helped Constance Walker bring a colleague back to her senses.
    #164 He has helped Elsa Fallows with her research.
    #163 He has been marked by the Seal of Nature.
    #162 He unlocked the mysteries of the Gem of Crys.
    #161 He ousted the invading orcs and brought harmony to the lucidians of Syxsl.
    #160 He triumphed against lucidian oppressors and freed the orcs of Mount Krog.
    #159 He has helped Kurteba starve the Ice Tribes.
    #158 He fulfilled the Dynodeon objectives of Project Red Dynara.
    #157 He did assist Professor Pheslida Pheeif-Zluush with her scientific research.
    #156 He carries the Iklaran Mark of the Bearer of Vessels.
  • VersaleanVersalean Member Posts: 964 Mythical

    Displaying DSC_0414JPG
  • MoiMoi Member Posts: 1,161 Transcendent
    ---[Ianir on 10/7 @ 14:42 sets as draft]

    Ianir bestmin.
  • FalaeronFalaeron Jolteon Member Posts: 1,663 Transcendent
    Scavenger hunts. Always fun.
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