"Oh yeah, you're a naughty mayor, aren't you? Misfile that Form MA631-D. Comptroller Shevat's got a nice gemstone disc for you, but yer gonna have to beg for it."
I thought my obtained power from last night was related to someone becoming mortal due to splintering/sharding. Turns out it relates to how long I last in the game.
Fyler also mentioned having a superwin condition after I did. And mentioned splintering after I mentioned mortals.
I'm not ready to vote for Fyler but hella trust drop dawg.
I've been trying to think through Phoebus' argument that Yomoigu didn't
kill Breandryn. We know Weiwae jailed Yomo that night, but don't know
with certainty if the jailing took, since at least one Soulless
strongarm kill was confirmed.
But either way, what's also
problematic for me is that we only have Yomo's statement that Shaddus
was a strongarm kill. Claiming that he jailed Shaddus when actually
killing him, and suggesting a strongarm killer could be quite a good
alibi. Bonus points were achieved when Portius flipped and strongarm
being in play was confirmed. But we know Portius couldn't have been the
strongarm killer because of his failed lynch.
So if Shaddus
wasn't strongarmed, then if Yomo started with his own
strongarm/inherited Portius' Almighty power, or was otherwise
block-immune as a Leviathan, he could have been free to kill Breandryn.
My problem with this theory: Yomo is a confirmed jailer, and a jailing Illith seems weird.
Because
of this I've had some niggling concerns about Fyler being Illith on the
back of furrikin appearing in the Hallifur post, but Selenity continues
to confirm Fyler, and it seems like it would be too hard to come up
with a claim that continues to get Selenity's confirmation with each
post. Not impossible mind you if sufficiently careful to only repeat
information already stated by Selenity, but it seems unlikely.
Which
leaves Lavinya as my only remaining candidate for Illith, but fitting
Lavinya to Illith is like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole.
Lavinya has demonstrated two different Day actions, and from my PoV,
seems more suited to being the remaining Traitor.
So this seems to peg Yomo as Illith
Despite how little sense a jailing Illith makes to
me, Othero's information paints him as a Soulless, and we've mislynched
twice by not following it. Danger - Silvanus could be trolling us by having soulless sense give the most misleading info.
Suspect Mysrai claim that has some
similarity to the Soulless rolesheet, fail 3 times -> lose power etc.
Would this be the jailing power? But then could he strongarm?
If Portius could lose Almighty title, maybe Yomo could inherit
it?
We only have his own
claim that a strongarm power was used to kill Shaddus. If it wasn't
used, he could have been free to kill Breandryn.
While he wasn't the only one to do so, originally voted for Othero in the Othero/Portius choice showdown.
Two town jailers doesn't seem likely, even if as limited as claimed.
So, nothing definitive, but
since we've mislynched twice by not following Othero's info to where it
leads, and despite how little sense a jailing Illith makes to me
I referred to my win condition ages ago when I offered up information that could possibly help confirm some townies aka the other people involved in the win condition.
This is simple. Selenity confirm this: the superwin is about Lusternia, not the Elder Wars.
Known Aliases: Celina/Cyndarin/Fire Jesus/The Night/That Bitch who griefed us
Ok, my thinking is if in doubt, reread Day 1. Fyler makes this post on page 7, and as far as I can see, this is before Selenity has revealed anything about herself.
Just so this day is over that much faster, I'm going to break my silence just this once and say that no, I am not one of the Triumvirate. Also, GG on outing the doctor. Get on with it.
Why have you been posting distinctly like Jadice then? Or are you like...Zvoltz or...another logic god. Is Zvoltz super logic-y? I don't know Hallifax gods well enough.
He could also be Xyl.
He could also be Illith. Unless there are post restrictions on certain roles enforcing roleplay, we have to assume that deception is a thing.
Right, which is why I want to lynch him. He's posting a certain way, and it's distinguishable and specific, and he's not new so he knows doing that just throws people through a loop.
The he could very well be using a posting flavor in lieu of a claim, because a claim is dangerous. The Triumvirate is probably in this game, as they are huge players in the Elder Wars, so fake claiming one of them would be dumb. So a pseudo claim through a type of posting is both safe and a way to deflect attention.
Then again he could just be hinting at Xyl. I will say I splintered in the Elder Wars, so it's possible.
But again, flavor posting is bad mojo. Xeii had an excuse, he does not.
... All that means it's that she's playing a God who splintered, not that her powers have to do with splintering. Fyler's defense this whole game has been 'you should trust me because Selenity' trusts me'
Your win condition says Major Victory for Town? Well mine says for Lusternia.
I give up, I feel like my credibility has been undermined and called into question by something totally outside my ability to control or influence. I wouldn't have leaned so heavily on Selenity's trust if I knew all this mess was coming.
I don't know why you people think I'd create this bluff weeks ago to draw attention to myself, but it is what it is. Better have a backup plan if you lynch me.
Known Aliases: Celina/Cyndarin/Fire Jesus/The Night/That Bitch who griefed us
(Sorry there were factions and now I'm doing a ton of chemistry homework, but I'm desperate to stop paying attention to my work for a few minutes and I'll take this ping as an excuse to do so.)
I was working under the assumption that being jailed would prevent a strongman power from being used, as jailing functions as a roleblock; I figured that while the kill would go through most protections on the target, it would not be able to bypass oneself being blocked. However, I seem to have been mistaken. Upon looking up that specific situation, I found that the mafiascum wiki states "A Roleblocker cannot block a Commuter or an Ascetic role, and cannot stop a Strongman from committing a kill." Therefore, it is entirely possible that a strongman kill would still succeed while the user is jailed, and thus my entire premise for not suspecting Yomoigu no longer applies.
So Selenity's pivot on Fyler really has thrown the cat among the pigeons.
I'm wondering if Selenity/Fates have a bonus win condition that requires Bollikin splintering. If Elder Wars were to finish without Bollikin splintering, their role overseeing the tapestry would be boring until this new timeline generates a reason that causes Elders to splinter.
But lynching = throwing into the Void, and not splintering, so this doesn't seem to add up, unless Bollikin will splinter rather than be thrown into the Void?
But Fyler also claims to be key to this bonus win condition, which is now being disputed by Selenity. Is it no longer reliant on someone splintering?
Selenity gaining a power based on how long she's survived and sudden flip on Fyler also seems a bit like Ieptix's role in Los Alamos mafia, who would have gained a kill power on the successful completion of the H-bomb, but at the cost of no longer being able to trust his bomb-making partner.
There, Sylandra won the game before his bomb was completed, and his partner was killed off early so that Silvanus' creating-distrust aspect never materialized.
But shades of that are happening again here, two players previously aligned now doubting each other?
Not saying your gained power is a kill, but why are the Fates suddenly gaining powers?
---
Also, Fyler's reputation as Queen of Bluffs (tm) isn't fashioned from whole cloth. Has bluffed very successfully in the past. Definitely a more complex and long-term bluff going on here, if it is one, since it is completely reliant on another player.
But Page 7 quote above is consistent with Bollikin. Haven't looked back to find specific locations, but do recall mentions of
squirrels, furriness etc. too which is also consistent with the claim.
Problems: Hallifur mod-post raises some concerns about Bollikin being present in the game. I had also questioned Selenity why Fyler saying she splinters on death was sufficient proof of innocence, given we already had evidence of splintering in terenti, elcryionites etc. and response wasn't 100% convincing.
Devil's advocate: mods make mistakes, and interpretation of flavour can be notoriously unreliable.
---
Leaning toward Fyler/Selenity distrust being a Los Alamos Teller–Ulam scenario and Silvanus being devious.
So Selenity's pivot on Fyler really has thrown the cat among the pigeons.
I'm wondering if Selenity/Fates have a bonus win condition that requires Bollikin splintering. If Elder Wars were to finish without Bollikin splintering, their role overseeing the tapestry would be boring until this new timeline generates a reason that causes Elders to splinter.
But lynching = throwing into the Void, and not splintering, so this doesn't seem to add up, unless Bollikin will splinter rather than be thrown into the Void?
But Fyler also claims to be key to this bonus win condition, which is now being disputed by Selenity. Is it no longer reliant on someone splintering?
Selenity gaining a power based on how long she's survived and sudden flip on Fyler also seems a bit like Ieptix's role in Los Alamos mafia, who would have gained a kill power on the successful completion of the H-bomb, but at the cost of no longer being able to trust his bomb-making partner.
There, Sylandra won the game before his bomb was completed, and his partner was killed off early so that Silvanus' creating-distrust aspect never materialized.
But shades of that are happening again here, two players previously aligned now doubting each other?
Not saying your gained power is a kill, but why are the Fates suddenly gaining powers?
---
Also, Fyler's reputation as Queen of Bluffs (tm) isn't fashioned from whole cloth. Has bluffed very successfully in the past. Definitely a more complex and long-term bluff going on here, if it is one, since it is completely reliant on another player.
But Page 7 quote above is consistent with Bollikin. Haven't looked back to find specific locations, but do recall mentions of
squirrels, furriness etc. too which is also consistent with the claim.
Problems: Hallifur mod-post raises some concerns about Bollikin being present in the game. I had also questioned Selenity why Fyler saying she splinters on death was sufficient proof of innocence, given we already had evidence of splintering in terenti, elcryionites etc. and response wasn't 100% convincing.
Devil's advocate: mods make mistakes, and interpretation of flavour can be notoriously unreliable.
---
Leaning toward Fyler/Selenity distrust being a Los Alamos Teller–Ulam scenario and Silvanus being devious.
Thoughts?
I will paraphrase (I don't think I can quote it still, can I?) what my role said.
The lives of Elders and their destinies are pretty much
straight lines. Mortals, however, can surprise. My power to
reweave Fate may be unlocked.
What I took this to mean was that we needed mortals for my power to be unlocked. Which is why I believed splintering to be a thing.
Which is why when Fyler said "hey my roll lets me splinter" I was like "Wait what really" and thought they were what I needed for my power to be unlocked, that they splinter. It was at this point I started believing Fyler.
Cue last night. My power to Reweave the Tapestry got unlocked. Fyler is still here. Fyler is still talking. Nobody died who has a splinter or a shard ability.
Cue me going "wtf" and "I think Fyler played me for a fool and I no longer believe them."
On top of that, Fyler would have reason to play this game if actually a Soulless. They know they can't kill me, Fates yo, but they also would get the benefit of having someone reaffirm them as town over and over and over again so long as I was suckered. And I was. Leading them to be safe from lynching.
Aggghhh, I had just about convinced myself to vote Yomo again, but that's now swinging me to Fyler.
Was Silvanus being devious in a Teller-Ulam way by causing you to distrust Fyler, or was he being devious by having Othero's information make Yomo look guilty?
Kudos Silvanus, you create one hell of a tangled web to figure out.
Okay, starting to get a little bit more convinced of Yomoigu's innocence, despite how guilty he looks in other aspects.
Night 4, when Shaddus died, Othero straightaway revealed that he was jailed but that a Soulless killed Shaddus. Breandryn then posted about her delivery to Shaddus failing which Yomoigu picks up on pretty quickly, trying to clarify if it failed due to death, or for some other reason.
This questioning of Breandryn -could- have been Yomo trying to find a patsy, but trying to frame Clangorum seems odd, especially since as a Soulless killer, it would have been better not to connect himself with Shaddus at all and to keep his mouth shut.
But this could also be consistent with knowing Shaddus was jailed, and testing for discrepancies with Breandryn's claim, as claimed. Which makes me think his claim that Shaddus was killed by a strongarm is true.
Concerns: Why aren't you defending yourself more? Investijailer is so hard to buy. Was questioning of Breandryn an elaborate alibi?
Honestly the one thing clearing Fyler was Selenity. We've seen zero information on powers, no other confirmation, zip nothing. I think Selenity may have even been an unwitting symp (anyone ever play mafia with that role? tres fun). I am heavily leaning to vote the one who has been skating along under the protection of someone else just because.
That being said I'm still not convinced the blocking of Yomo last night isn't just a made up red herring, so I am willing to vote for either.
I don't know why you guys keep harping on the Hallifur thing. Didn't Silvanus come out and say the flavor text has no direct influence on the game? I mean, there was a book of Fyler...and Fyler is clearly me, the publicly known forums alt of a TA, and not an Elder God.
Frankly, Selenity's misunderstanding has backed me into a corner, my case would have been made earlier and differently had I not had a supporter giving me a knowing wink and agreeing to every post I made referencing the information. I've pushed back on nearly every challenge with it, because it was the safest way to proceed without showing my hand.
As I've said, I don't know the details of this condition. Kind of like Selenity didn't know the details of her new whatever power. We both thought we had an understanding, aka the missing pieces our roles indicated existed but gave no details of, and it wasn't until Selenity figured out what that piece was that we knew we had been operating under incorrect assumptions. I don't know why Selenity finds the act of her being incorrect as evidence of me "playing" her.
Naturally, showing my hand is a lot more believable early in the game when people aren't asking for it rather than very late when people are expecting it. Plus, the bluff reputation isn't exactly helping me here, but I reiterate that my previous bluffs were situational and made sense in the situations. They served a specific purpose when I was under scrutiny. There was no purpose to draw attention to myself with a phantom information bluff. If I was good at bluffing, this was a dumbass bluff.
At any rate, having spent the game operating based on a certain set of information, I played that way. My cards are exceedingly limited, as I have repeatedly stated. My role is not a provable one. At this point, if I am going to be lynched, it appears to be because I am an unknown. I can't really cease to be an unknown, so I don't see a way to argue out of it.
So lynch me if that's the case, game is close enough to being over that I don't have to follow weeks more of posting to use my shard voting power. It certainly won't help you win, so you better have a backup plan when I flip. Town is operating on borrowed time.
Known Aliases: Celina/Cyndarin/Fire Jesus/The Night/That Bitch who griefed us
And when I flip, I will openly mock all of you, as I think it's a lazy play. Why would I bluff a sharding power knowing Illith shards, why would I throw the lure of phantom information into the water knowing I couldn't ever actually back it up unless I was town?
I don't get it.
Known Aliases: Celina/Cyndarin/Fire Jesus/The Night/That Bitch who griefed us
Concerns: Why aren't you defending yourself more? Investijailer is so hard to buy. Was questioning of Breandryn an elaborate alibi?
At the time the only thing we knew for certain was that Breandryn had a kill immunity...every time she tried to deliver an item it failed somehow. When she said she tried to deliver an item to Shaddus and it failed, I wanted to see if she had been turned away by my jailing (which would have presumably happened had Shaddus lived) or if she didn't know that he had been jailed (because she was actually his killer who had bypassed my jailing). Not having any failure-specific fluff attached to her attempt made my question useless, but at the time I was hopeful.
Comments
Waiting on Silvanus to respond to my PMs regarding something.
Congratulations @Phoebus you're the only one I trust right now. You can hate me for it later.
Fyler also mentioned having a superwin condition after I did. And mentioned splintering after I mentioned mortals.
I'm not ready to vote for Fyler but hella trust drop dawg.
But either way, what's also problematic for me is that we only have Yomo's statement that Shaddus was a strongarm kill. Claiming that he jailed Shaddus when actually killing him, and suggesting a strongarm killer could be quite a good alibi. Bonus points were achieved when Portius flipped and strongarm being in play was confirmed. But we know Portius couldn't have been the strongarm killer because of his failed lynch.
So if Shaddus wasn't strongarmed, then if Yomo started with his own strongarm/inherited Portius' Almighty power, or was otherwise block-immune as a Leviathan, he could have been free to kill Breandryn.
My problem with this theory: Yomo is a confirmed jailer, and a jailing Illith seems weird.
Because of this I've had some niggling concerns about Fyler being Illith on the back of furrikin appearing in the Hallifur post, but Selenity continues to confirm Fyler, and it seems like it would be too hard to come up with a claim that continues to get Selenity's confirmation with each post. Not impossible mind you if sufficiently careful to only repeat information already stated by Selenity, but it seems unlikely.
Which leaves Lavinya as my only remaining candidate for Illith, but fitting Lavinya to Illith is like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. Lavinya has demonstrated two different Day actions, and from my PoV, seems more suited to being the remaining Traitor.
So this seems to peg Yomo as Illith
- Despite how little sense a jailing Illith makes to
me, Othero's information paints him as a Soulless, and we've mislynched
twice by not following it. Danger - Silvanus could be trolling us by having soulless sense give the most misleading info.
- Suspect Mysrai claim that has some
similarity to the Soulless rolesheet, fail 3 times -> lose power etc.
Would this be the jailing power? But then could he strongarm?
If Portius could lose Almighty title, maybe Yomo could inherit
it?
- We only have his own
claim that a strongarm power was used to kill Shaddus. If it wasn't
used, he could have been free to kill Breandryn.
- While he wasn't the only one to do so, originally voted for Othero in the Othero/Portius choice showdown.
- Two town jailers doesn't seem likely, even if as limited as claimed.
So, nothing definitive, but since we've mislynched twice by not following Othero's info to where it leads, and despite how little sense a jailing Illith makes to meVote Yomoigu
Goddamnit Selenity, I only cleared Fyler because you were so sure about her.
This is simple. Selenity confirm this: the superwin is about Lusternia, not the Elder Wars.
Back to my gut. Vote Yomoigu
Well... That's not the case anymore
My unique abilities will enable a Major Victory for Town.
I give up, I feel like my credibility has been undermined and called into question by something totally outside my ability to control or influence. I wouldn't have leaned so heavily on Selenity's trust if I knew all this mess was coming.
I don't know why you people think I'd create this bluff weeks ago to draw attention to myself, but it is what it is. Better have a backup plan if you lynch me.
I was working under the assumption that being jailed would prevent a strongman power from being used, as jailing functions as a roleblock; I figured that while the kill would go through most protections on the target, it would not be able to bypass oneself being blocked. However, I seem to have been mistaken. Upon looking up that specific situation, I found that the mafiascum wiki states "A Roleblocker cannot block a Commuter or an Ascetic role, and cannot stop a Strongman from committing a kill." Therefore, it is entirely possible that a strongman kill would still succeed while the user is jailed, and thus my entire premise for not suspecting Yomoigu no longer applies.
In light of this,
Vote: Yomoigu
I'm wondering if Selenity/Fates have a bonus win condition that requires Bollikin splintering. If Elder Wars were to finish without Bollikin splintering, their role overseeing the tapestry would be boring until this new timeline generates a reason that causes Elders to splinter.
But lynching = throwing into the Void, and not splintering, so this doesn't seem to add up, unless Bollikin will splinter rather than be thrown into the Void?
But Fyler also claims to be key to this bonus win condition, which is now being disputed by Selenity. Is it no longer reliant on someone splintering?
Selenity gaining a power based on how long she's survived and sudden flip on Fyler also seems a bit like Ieptix's role in Los Alamos mafia, who would have gained a kill power on the successful completion of the H-bomb, but at the cost of no longer being able to trust his bomb-making partner.
There, Sylandra won the game before his bomb was completed, and his partner was killed off early so that Silvanus' creating-distrust aspect never materialized.
But shades of that are happening again here, two players previously aligned now doubting each other?
Not saying your gained power is a kill, but why are the Fates suddenly gaining powers?
---
Also, Fyler's reputation as Queen of Bluffs (tm) isn't fashioned from whole cloth. Has bluffed very successfully in the past. Definitely a more complex and long-term bluff going on here, if it is one, since it is completely reliant on another player.
But Page 7 quote above is consistent with Bollikin. Haven't looked back to find specific locations, but do recall mentions of squirrels, furriness etc. too which is also consistent with the claim.
Problems: Hallifur mod-post raises some concerns about Bollikin being present in the game. I had also questioned Selenity why Fyler saying she splinters on death was sufficient proof of innocence, given we already had evidence of splintering in terenti, elcryionites etc. and response wasn't 100% convincing.
Devil's advocate: mods make mistakes, and interpretation of flavour can be notoriously unreliable.
---
Leaning toward Fyler/Selenity distrust being a Los Alamos Teller–Ulam scenario and Silvanus being devious.
Thoughts?
The lives of Elders and their destinies are pretty much straight lines. Mortals, however, can surprise. My power to reweave Fate may be unlocked.
What I took this to mean was that we needed mortals for my power to be unlocked. Which is why I believed splintering to be a thing.
Which is why when Fyler said "hey my roll lets me splinter" I was like "Wait what really" and thought they were what I needed for my power to be unlocked, that they splinter. It was at this point I started believing Fyler.
Cue last night. My power to Reweave the Tapestry got unlocked. Fyler is still here. Fyler is still talking. Nobody died who has a splinter or a shard ability.
Cue me going "wtf" and "I think Fyler played me for a fool and I no longer believe them."
Screw it. I've convinced myself.
Unvote.
Vote: Fyler.
Was Silvanus being devious in a Teller-Ulam way by causing you to distrust Fyler, or was he being devious by having Othero's information make Yomo look guilty?
Kudos Silvanus, you create one hell of a tangled web to figure out.
Night 4, when Shaddus died, Othero straightaway revealed that he was jailed but that a Soulless killed Shaddus. Breandryn then posted about her delivery to Shaddus failing which Yomoigu picks up on pretty quickly, trying to clarify if it failed due to death, or for some other reason.
This questioning of Breandryn -could- have been Yomo trying to find a patsy, but trying to frame Clangorum seems odd, especially since as a Soulless killer, it would have been better not to connect himself with Shaddus at all and to keep his mouth shut.
But this could also be consistent with knowing Shaddus was jailed, and testing for discrepancies with Breandryn's claim, as claimed. Which makes me think his claim that Shaddus was killed by a strongarm is true.
Concerns: Why aren't you defending yourself more? Investijailer is so hard to buy. Was questioning of Breandryn an elaborate alibi?
Can we have a vote count @Silvanus?
Honestly the one thing clearing Fyler was Selenity. We've seen zero information on powers, no other confirmation, zip nothing. I think Selenity may have even been an unwitting symp (anyone ever play mafia with that role? tres fun). I am heavily leaning to vote the one who has been skating along under the protection of someone else just because.
That being said I'm still not convinced the blocking of Yomo last night isn't just a made up red herring, so I am willing to vote for either.
Frankly, Selenity's misunderstanding has backed me into a corner, my case would have been made earlier and differently had I not had a supporter giving me a knowing wink and agreeing to every post I made referencing the information. I've pushed back on nearly every challenge with it, because it was the safest way to proceed without showing my hand.
As I've said, I don't know the details of this condition. Kind of like Selenity didn't know the details of her new whatever power. We both thought we had an understanding, aka the missing pieces our roles indicated existed but gave no details of, and it wasn't until Selenity figured out what that piece was that we knew we had been operating under incorrect assumptions. I don't know why Selenity finds the act of her being incorrect as evidence of me "playing" her.
Naturally, showing my hand is a lot more believable early in the game when people aren't asking for it rather than very late when people are expecting it. Plus, the bluff reputation isn't exactly helping me here, but I reiterate that my previous bluffs were situational and made sense in the situations. They served a specific purpose when I was under scrutiny. There was no purpose to draw attention to myself with a phantom information bluff. If I was good at bluffing, this was a dumbass bluff.
At any rate, having spent the game operating based on a certain set of information, I played that way. My cards are exceedingly limited, as I have repeatedly stated. My role is not a provable one. At this point, if I am going to be lynched, it appears to be because I am an unknown. I can't really cease to be an unknown, so I don't see a way to argue out of it.
So lynch me if that's the case, game is close enough to being over that I don't have to follow weeks more of posting to use my shard voting power. It certainly won't help you win, so you better have a backup plan when I flip. Town is operating on borrowed time.
I don't get it.