Phase II: Buff Overhaul

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Comments

  • TarkentonTarkenton Traitor Bear Member Posts: 2,555 Transcendent
    So, they go on clothing.  Why bother putting it on a weapon in the first place?

    As for the damage type runes, welcome to the other side of the fence.  Here's your picket sign, and a barrel to burn all your ignored posts in.
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  • ShuyinShuyin The pug life chose me. Member Posts: 1,613 Transcendent
    edited June 2015
    Yeah, no point in weapons when they can go on clothing.

    Fine with me though.
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  • KallisteKalliste Member Posts: 115 Capable
    Celina said:
    So here's another big issue. Split damage types are now required to get twice the credits for the same buff that single type damagers need. I need 600 for the same 9% buff that a mage is paying 300 credits for. This has been an issue since day 1 due to how curios and tattoos work, but was significantly softened because the magic damage runes were universal 15% and accounted for the largest buff to damage. Now you've converted them to damage type specific and really boned us that where already boned enough. If I want to buff nightkiss and nightgaze fully, I need 1200 credits, vs a mage who wants to buff the same 2 attacks for 600 credits. An enormous 600 credit disparity between what I need vs what a mage needs.

    This was the single biggest complaint about warrior artifacts, that the investment was unfairly slanted towards casters and that a warrior, for equal investment, got far less bang for their buck. It feel like you took the feedback, reversed it, and just made it suck for casters with split damage typing too. 

    I really don't think it's fair to ask twice the investment from a Shadowdancer that you do from a Geomancer for the same benefit, in the same overhaul where we are stating we want to equalize things to remove outliers. I feel like twice the credit investment for damage buffs is a significant outlier. 

    I feel like I'm sending complaints out into the void at this point. Not getting a lot of feedback and I like to think I'm being thoughtful and specific enough for them to be valid. 

    I agree that it makes things expensive, and I think I understand the underlying sentiment. The flip side is that if people want to optimally defend themselves against split damage using resistance buffs, they likely also need to invest in multiple resistance runes. I'm just curious if you think that, in addition to reverting back to a standard magic source enhancement artifact, there should also be a standard magic source resistance artifact?

    I get the sense that most classes that have a 100% damage type attack also have access to attacks with split damage types. Is that correct? What is the historical reasoning that split damage types were considered beneficial? I can't imagine it was just added for flavor... I understand the potential benefits when you can tune your damage for a given situation, but what about attacks that are a flat 50/50 split damage type? 
  • SteingrimSteingrim Member Posts: 904 Fabled
    Shuyin said:
    Yeah, no point in weapons when they can go on clothing. Fine with me though.
    For myself I would also agree, but for some it makes the item both non-decay and customizable.
    You tell Wyrden Ravager Tarken, "Come to Gaudiguch. I'll give you the title of Grand Moth."
    Eyes peering skywards as he thinks, Ironbeard the Magnanimous says to Sksez, "Welll, on my gooD lis *hic* t, we have....Stei *hic* ng *hic* rim.U..Xypherv....Luu *hic* hghaigh *hic* hhe....Breandryn....."
  • QistrelQistrel the hemisemidemifink Member Posts: 1,717 Transcendent
    For 75 credits instead of the 150 that a rune of gripping costs.

  • RiviusRivius Your resident wolf puppy Member Posts: 1,624 Transcendent
    edited June 2015
    1) I was wondering, can we have in the 'total' row, a bracketed percentage? eg.
    Total (including universal) 1(x%)

    Just for quick reference?

    2) Also, given this new system's way of capping buffs, should we reconsider making curio buffs/resistances one-at-time?
  • LeradLerad Member Posts: 2,405 Transcendent
    @Roark

    It appears that the resistance from bookbinding's magictome isn't showing up in bodyscan. Not sure if it's enabled. I've bugged it as well, just in case.

  • BaelorBaelor Member Posts: 268 Master
    I brought up the topic of damage runes, split damage attacks and the possibility of a universal damage rune with Estarra.

    Putting it simply, there are no plans to add a universal damage rune at any point.

    Split damage attacks do require twice the investment to maximise damage out of, but they also require twice the investment to mitigate, whereas single damage types are countered by a single rune.



    On a side note, all feedback is being taken and considered. While we may not take your ideas on board, that does not mean they're dismissed without any thought or discussion. Player feedback has been involved at changing many aspects of this overhaul so far, and likely will continue to be.

    While we can't respond to every single idea, that doesn't mean they're being ignored.
  • ShuyinShuyin The pug life chose me. Member Posts: 1,613 Transcendent
    It's all right bros, just buy divinus and fire resist, then call it good.
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  • ViynainViynain Member Posts: 253 Master
    Rivius said:
    1) I was wondering, can we have in the 'total' row, a bracketed percentage? eg.
    Total (including universal) 1(x%)

    Just for quick reference?

    2) Also, given this new system's way of capping buffs, should we reconsider making curio buffs/resistances one-at-time?
    +1 to the idea of adding a Total column to the BODYSCAN outputs. @Roark or @Ieptix, would this be possible, please? *flutter*

    Also, regarding curios, what do you mean? It looks like CURIO POWERs needs updating and so do AB files, come to think of it, but are you talking changes mechanically? If so, how?
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  • RiviusRivius Your resident wolf puppy Member Posts: 1,624 Transcendent
    edited June 2015
    Oh, I was just thinking, since the new mechanics allow us to cap damage and resist buffs so that they're not as much of a problem to stack multiple things, maybe we could make all curios always 'active' so you get benefits from all the ones you've completed at the same time. Although, that's just a loose suggestion, I don't know if that would end up causing more of an undesired artifact skew.
  • XenthosXenthos Shadow Lord Member Posts: 6,023 Transcendent
    edited June 2015
    I like the idea of making curios all active now (because now things can't keep stacking, and curios are intentionally set to a relatively low cap of /7).  There's no real reason not to just make them all active if you have them imo (it would be different if they were /10s instead).

    @Baelor / @Estarra : How about instead of a universal, you convert the runes to be by "grouping" instead?

    Elemental: Fire / Cold / Electricity.
    Cosmic: Divinus / Excorable.
    Physical: Blunt / Cutting / Poison.
    Magical/Misc: Magic / Asphyx / Psychic.

    I'm still pretty firm on the idea that there are just Too Many Runes.  The thing is definitely way more complicated than it needs to be, and as I've said, it's frustrating enough to me that I went from being excited to invest to just not even bothering... the entire point of this overhaul was to make things easier, but I just don't see this as being easier at all.

    Edit: And remember, I was excited / interested enough to go out of my way to spend a huge deal of time trying to balance / convert skills.  I wouldn't have done that if I was ambivalent about the whole process. :P
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  • QistrelQistrel the hemisemidemifink Member Posts: 1,717 Transcendent
    I appreciate the clothing permanence.

    Now, someone give me 3300 credits.

  • DaganevDaganev Member Posts: 755 Master
    Yay pernament helmets!

    Though it will be impossible to figure out which rune to attach.
  • LavinyaLavinya Queen of Snark AustraliaMember Posts: 3,371 Transcendent
    edited June 2015
    Roark said:
    Regen runes are for worn jewelry. Damage resistance runes for worn clothing. Damage enhancement runes are for wielded weapons, including staves, swords, etc. They can also go on worn clothing since some players switch around weapons.
    @Roark @Baelor @Ieptix
    Can damage enhancement runes be placed on whips? And can watches be included as jewellery for the same purpose? I removed my old magic damage rune from a watch which is now about to decay but I can't seem to put a replacement on it. And I figured since a whip is a wielded weapon if would be able to take a damage enhancement rune, but apparently not. Is this something I should bug, or is it deliberate?



  • BaelorBaelor Member Posts: 268 Master
    Whips aren't classed as weapons, it's a technicality issue. While you wield it to use it, you can't SWING as you can a conventional weapon (also when you weaponprobe it doesn't have stats)

    It's intended.
  • LavinyaLavinya Queen of Snark AustraliaMember Posts: 3,371 Transcendent
    Mmk, though you'd think that since the runes can go on clothing and make them permanent, there wouldn't be an issue in putting them on something that's already permanent. :p


    Watches?



  • BaelorBaelor Member Posts: 268 Master
    Watches are jewellery.
  • QistrelQistrel the hemisemidemifink Member Posts: 1,717 Transcendent
    You skill level in Low/High Magic used to give some DMP vs magic damage. Has this been done away with?

  • AkyaevinAkyaevin Member Posts: 586 Fabled
    I don't believe it's ever given DMP. It and Resilience acted outside the DMP system.

    Get someone with a cord to skillflex it off and on to test damages.
  • QistrelQistrel the hemisemidemifink Member Posts: 1,717 Transcendent
    I used to have DMP to cutting/blunt from resilience though. Hm.

  • SynkarinSynkarin Nothing to see here Member Posts: 3,216 Transcendent
    Resilience DMP was missed, I'm not sure what they're going to do about it, but I do know it was forgotten about when the first coded it in

    Everiine said:
    "'Cause the fighting don't stop till I walk in."
    -Synkarin's Lament.
  • LeradLerad Member Posts: 2,405 Transcendent
    Could always delete it and refund the lessons.
    [-O<

  • CyndarinCyndarin used Flamethrower! It was super effective. Member Posts: 4,508 Transcendent
    Lerad said:
    Could always delete it and refund the lessons.
    [-O<
    I support this. It only ever served to punish people for not being trans by making them warrior food. 
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  • BaelorBaelor Member Posts: 268 Master
    Resilience is something we are discussing still internally, no final decision on what we're doing with it yet.
  • SynkarinSynkarin Nothing to see here Member Posts: 3,216 Transcendent
    I'm down with deleting and refunding lessons - if anything, it could be merged with discipline, like the old Magic skillset was merged with low/high magic

    Everiine said:
    "'Cause the fighting don't stop till I walk in."
    -Synkarin's Lament.
  • EodhEodh Member Posts: 340 Gifted
    Environment would be a more suitable skill in which to fold Resilience, but yeah. We have/had a couple of 'supplementary' skills that require a full skill investment. Better to just fold them into each other.

  • KallisteKalliste Member Posts: 115 Capable
    I suspect this was discussed somewhere in the many ongoing threads and I just missed it, but do we know how exactly cutting and blunt buffs and resistances will impact wounding?
  • ElanorwenElanorwen The White Falconess Member Posts: 2,927 Transcendent
    Kalliste said:
    I suspect this was discussed somewhere in the many ongoing threads and I just missed it, but do we know how exactly cutting and blunt buffs and resistances will impact wounding?
    I believe wounding is affected only by armour. As such, cutting/blunt resistances shouldn't affect it at all.
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    Forgiveness is the fragrance that the violet sheds on the heel that has crushed it.
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