@Alary, you investigated @Tremula and saw that she was a serial killer... and then investigated @Krackenor, and saw nothing more than his name? Something doesn't add up.
Hamlet is Hamlet. He knows too much and not enough at any given moment. I said he was Hamlet, and Hamlet he is. His role is as apt as his naming, but it is up to him to share that knowledge. I only care about threats, and Hamlet is not a threat.
Mysrai, the Beckoner Beyond the Maze intones, "Continue to manifest the paradigm of working, My Alary."
The Divine voice of Camus the Cinderfly echoes in your head, "Thank you, once-body. I am happy that I fell into that eye."
I think I'll VOTE:TREMULA too. She's been called out, and she's flailing at people and grasping at straws, trying to draw attention from herself. Being argumentative is a sign of being either Xenthos, or guilty.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
Your claim sits poorly with me, fair Alary
For several reasons which you soon shall see.
First and foremost, I wonder why you risk
Revealing yourself so early and so brisk (ly)
When the luted tremula was all but assured
A noosed place upon the wall, her eyes feeding the birds.
Second among my list of concerns
Is that you describe the Prince of Denmark as 'just', an insult that surely burns
My pride. That which is most important to me
And so I say to you, suspicious alary
Reveal my role completely, and get to it with a hop,
Lest I turn my wrath to burn you, and name the a Mafioso role cop!
Vote Alary
Tell me why it shouldn't be you, since you've posted nothing substantial.
I especially find this amusing, considering we all know Rolsand isn't extraordinarily talkative, and he's new to Mafia games.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
(This is my first mafia game, so I don't actually know what role means what. What I have given is what I was given. Forgive my ignorance.)
I have revealed myself because it is my place to see a serial killer put down. I simply backed up what was said with facts, to make it more of a solid case. Lynch me, and you lose a key piece on this stage. You know more than you should to those around you, and that should satisfy you, Hamlet. You are not one to hide behind others, admit to your name, Dane, and we can rid this stage of a pesky killer and move on with the show.
Mysrai, the Beckoner Beyond the Maze intones, "Continue to manifest the paradigm of working, My Alary."
The Divine voice of Camus the Cinderfly echoes in your head, "Thank you, once-body. I am happy that I fell into that eye."
At this point, I still consider @Tremula's allegiance an unknown. @Alary's role claim throws a huge monkey wrench into what I know and what I suspect. It clashes so much that my gut reaction is that it's false. We need Alary to announce what was discovered of @Krackenor's role (explicitly name his power), with the caveat that such an admission being verified could serve as a powerful means of establishing town's trust in two collaborating mafia.
For the record, Alary did NOT visit Tremula last night. Ergo, the presumptive order is Alary visited Tremula on night 1, and Krackenor on night 2. If you go back and read Alary's post following night 1, there's a weak attempt to raise suspicion against Tremula. By weak I mean not overt and pushy, which would make sense for an investigator not wanting to have to explain their information. This doesn't explain whether Alary is hero or villain - there's reason for a villain investigator to want to provide town with verifiable information, again to establish trust, especially if its by giving up the SK who might accidentally kill a mafia member.
Also, a couple of the role claims that followed my announcement felt weak to me, but one fire at a time I suppose.
I would only assume, then, that our fair Dane is nothing but a voyeur, one who peeps and stalks for his own amusement. What Eldanien said is true, Tremula was my first target, followed by Krackenor. I expose myself now to give us answers, so that we may push forward. But, all of this is subjective to the mob. I am but at the mercy of my fellow men.
(for the record, I don't get told explicitly what powers are, I get a description. I'm too much of a novice to really get things so I'm juggling the best I can.)
Mysrai, the Beckoner Beyond the Maze intones, "Continue to manifest the paradigm of working, My Alary."
The Divine voice of Camus the Cinderfly echoes in your head, "Thank you, once-body. I am happy that I fell into that eye."
You're willing to kill, it seems without remorse. You are much more unstable and prone to violence than most men, and your mad outbursts make you wild and unpredictable. But that is just, considering you are Katherine, what other role would befit such a mad woman.
Mysrai, the Beckoner Beyond the Maze intones, "Continue to manifest the paradigm of working, My Alary."
The Divine voice of Camus the Cinderfly echoes in your head, "Thank you, once-body. I am happy that I fell into that eye."
You're willing to kill, it seems without remorse. You are much more unstable and prone to violence than most men, and your mad outbursts make you wild and unpredictable. But that is just, considering you are Katherine, what other role would befit such a mad woman.
I was requisitioned for a fiesty, daring, impetuous, and bold woman. Mad, say you, but the misogynistic farce you would place upon me enforces the submissive woman I am expected to be, as in every modern rendition.
However, you are incorrect, because even though as a shrewish maid I have the power to remove any I choose from the stage at night, I am but an actor and can only do so a limited amount of times before my voice runs ragged and I become as any other hero(ine).
I'm inclined to believe Alary. Tremula being 'unstable' and prone to violence doesn't really scream vigilante to me as much as serial killer. She also obviously has -some- kind of investigative powers because how else would she know Krackenor's character? He hasn't made a single hint that I've noticed about it.
It's not unusual for the mafia to have some sort of investigative role among their ranks, so I'm not completely exonerating her but I don't think she will prove to be mafia in the end.
What I DO wonder about now is Krackenor. It sounds like he has some sort of watcher/investigative power, right? But we already have Eldanien and I think he's basically confirmed as town. Notice how Krackenor also got a bit fiesty pants about Alary clearly being fake unless she knows every last word of his role text? To discredit her I presume because a) investigators scare the mafia and b) to probably distract from my exact line of thinking. If he can make it out like Alary has no idea of his role he is more free to claim some other power that hasn't already been revealed. Perhaps even gearing himself up for investigator counter-claim. I am highly suspicious of you right now, Krackenor!
Tremula though, presuming she is the serial killer, is way too chaotic to keep alive and I expect the mafia will want her gone just as much. There are arguments for giving it time to argue this all out, of course, but I'm also wary that time also allows for the sowing of doubt and perhaps saving her skin.
At this point, I will confirm that @Krackenor was the fifth visitor to @Tremula last night. I was hiding who I thought might be our town investigator, but Krackenor's role is basically revealed and either he's a hero and already a target for villains, or he's a villain and there's no need for me to hide his presence last night.
Now I have to ask: Krackenor, can you tell us anything more about Tremula's role than has already been revealed?
I think that it has been reasonably established that we have multiple investigators without full omniscient knowledge. Whether everyone shown to have investigative powers is hero or villain remains to be seen.
If I could edit my post, I would strike that line suggesting that we have multiple confirmed investigators. We have @Alary who claims a couple of unverified investigative results, and Krackenor who has been claimed by Alary to have unverified investigative powers. Tremula's 'revealed' status as an SK could be the same strong educated guess many of the rest of us are leaning toward.
For all I know, they're both scum building up an interesting story to cover each other. Seems like another explanation is more likely, but I'm not ready to discount that possibility.
Well phooey. Just this morning I was feeling exceedingly clever for having successfully conveyed the message to Eldanien that I was an investigator without outright saying it. Revealing myself is something I really wanted to avoid
In any case, yes. I am Hamlet, and I am an investigator for the heroes. I also happen to be the single-most unlucky investigator ever. Night One I attempted to take a look at Vivet, but was waylaid by a distracting drunk and was blocked from doing anything. Night Two I tried to take a look at Tremula and was unable to discover anything due to her gallivanting in Egypt.
Now, @Lavinya, let me try to walk you through my thought process and hopefully allay your suspicions. When @Alary out and out declared she was the investigator, I was convinced she was lying and trying to out the real investigator, i.e. me. It's also worth noting that, at this point in time, I thought that investigators were only ever for Town. When she named me, I was incredibly confused and spent the next ten minutes furiously googling different mafia roles. I saw that a not-uncommon role for the mafia was that of role-cop, or somebody who could garner names but not abilities. At this point, I made my poetic post with the accusation.
Even with her subsequent post revealing the outline of my power, I still believe that she is a villain, and here's why:
She knows names for certain, but whenever she tried to describe a power she was incredibly vague. Regarding Tremula Alary said nothing more than what Trem had already stated or what we were already thinking, and (as much as it stings my ego) I can't rule out the possibility that Alary figured out that I was one of those who Eldanien saw last night and assumed that my power was investigative or informative in nature. It was just enough to pique interest, but it could describe literally ANY of the information gathering roles. I think that she cast a wide net and hoped for the best. In this case, it obviously worked.
As my poem stated, the timing of Alary's reveal was very, very weird. Tremula was two votes away from being lynched and public opinion was heavily against her; there was absolutely no reason she had to open herself mafia attention to 'make more of a solid case'. A simple statement of 'this is really convincing, I'm going to see this wanton murderer put down!' and a vote for Tremula would have made the lynch all but guaranteed. If, however, her goal in 'revealing' herself was to draw out the real investigator for town (again...i.e. me), then she won. And honestly, it was an incredibly well played maneuver and I applaud you for it.
(Disclaimer: This point is based on supposition and meta-assumptions about the game instead of critical thinking) I highly doubt that the Heroes have 3 observer type roles. I know that I am on the side of the angels, and I'm relatively comfortable in Eldanien's innocence. Which leaves it quite unlikely in my mind that Alary, with her knowledge of names, is on our side as well.
Whatever the end result of this day is, I'm afraid that it will be a net win for the Mafia. They know multiple high priority roles now
By the way, the above is only intended to convey my thoughts about Alary; in no way does it mean that I think Tremula is NOT a serial killer. like Lavinya said, both Vigilante and SK would be reasonable targets to get rid of for the villains, and thus it's a relatively safe target against whom Alary could reveal herself.
Also convenient to have been unable to use your powers twice, Krackenor. I'm not convinced of your guilt or innocence (same with Alary, I have doubts now) but I'm frowning in your general directions!
@Lavinya (or anyone, really): Since we're still not too close to the end, but close enough for a snipe if the villains act together, who're you suggesting you and the other roleblocker block? We can coordinate that and let the protector do their thing.
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I feel like we've gotten all the useful material we are likely to get out of this topic.
We'll probably resume lynching @Tremula now. But we've got a few days yet. Should we discuss any of the other newly revealed roles? Remember, the odds are extraordinarily high that one of the people who visited Tremula is a villain.
I'm looking at the reveals and feeling very suspicious.
@CyndarinAscends basically claimed vanilla town, having had and used up (?) a one-shot power. Said one-shot power was meant to be used against mafia, and I'm not seeing enough reason for anyone to be convinced that Tremula was mafia (as opposed to SK or other third party type).
@Luce claims a role that looks like scum when he uses his investigative power - we sure have a lot of investigator types. Presumably, he'd use his investigative powers pretty much every night, which means he pretty much looks like scum all the time. That's a handy role claim for scum.
@Lavinya claims Cleopatra. The identity is more or less ironclad, since claiming someone else's character identity would have been pretty silly. I always viewed Cleopatra as a grey character - in the play, she's capricious, unreliable, petulant, lacking in most of the noble qualities or accessible identity one expects of a hero. At face value, she could easily be a villain. But I consider that to be a slim to none chance - why would villains jail someone AND target them for a kill?
Unless they targeted @Maylea, and we didn't have anyone catch that attempt. Or @Maylea was the villain chosen to perform a kill on yet someone else, but was stymied. Given a lack of information to suggest these alternatives, and so many people visiting Tremula, I tend to suspect Tremula was the villains' target.
I suppose it's possible, convoluted conspiracy theory time, Lavinya was to jail Tremula so that Tremula could have guilt assigned to her for being jailed, and only one death occurred overnight rather than two.
That's more or less the sum of my lines of thinking right now, though I feel like Cyndarin and Luce could probably stand some scrutiny. And from the perspective of others, probably myself as well.
Comments
For the record, Alary did NOT visit Tremula last night. Ergo, the presumptive order is Alary visited Tremula on night 1, and Krackenor on night 2. If you go back and read Alary's post following night 1, there's a weak attempt to raise suspicion against Tremula. By weak I mean not overt and pushy, which would make sense for an investigator not wanting to have to explain their information. This doesn't explain whether Alary is hero or villain - there's reason for a villain investigator to want to provide town with verifiable information, again to establish trust, especially if its by giving up the SK who might accidentally kill a mafia member.
Also, a couple of the role claims that followed my announcement felt weak to me, but one fire at a time I suppose.
Ixion tells you, "// I don't think anyone else had a clue, amazing form."
However, you are incorrect, because even though as a shrewish maid I have the power to remove any I choose from the stage at night, I am but an actor and can only do so a limited amount of times before my voice runs ragged and I become as any other hero(ine).
The true investigator, however, would know that.
Ixion tells you, "// I don't think anyone else had a clue, amazing form."
Now I have to ask: Krackenor, can you tell us anything more about Tremula's role than has already been revealed?
I think that it has been reasonably established that we have multiple investigators without full omniscient knowledge. Whether everyone shown to have investigative powers is hero or villain remains to be seen.
For all I know, they're both scum building up an interesting story to cover each other. Seems like another explanation is more likely, but I'm not ready to discount that possibility.
We'll probably resume lynching @Tremula now. But we've got a few days yet. Should we discuss any of the other newly revealed roles? Remember, the odds are extraordinarily high that one of the people who visited Tremula is a villain.
I'm looking at the reveals and feeling very suspicious.
@CyndarinAscends basically claimed vanilla town, having had and used up (?) a one-shot power. Said one-shot power was meant to be used against mafia, and I'm not seeing enough reason for anyone to be convinced that Tremula was mafia (as opposed to SK or other third party type).
@Luce claims a role that looks like scum when he uses his investigative power - we sure have a lot of investigator types. Presumably, he'd use his investigative powers pretty much every night, which means he pretty much looks like scum all the time. That's a handy role claim for scum.
@Lavinya claims Cleopatra. The identity is more or less ironclad, since claiming someone else's character identity would have been pretty silly. I always viewed Cleopatra as a grey character - in the play, she's capricious, unreliable, petulant, lacking in most of the noble qualities or accessible identity one expects of a hero. At face value, she could easily be a villain. But I consider that to be a slim to none chance - why would villains jail someone AND target them for a kill?
Unless they targeted @Maylea, and we didn't have anyone catch that attempt. Or @Maylea was the villain chosen to perform a kill on yet someone else, but was stymied. Given a lack of information to suggest these alternatives, and so many people visiting Tremula, I tend to suspect Tremula was the villains' target.
I suppose it's possible, convoluted conspiracy theory time, Lavinya was to jail Tremula so that Tremula could have guilt assigned to her for being jailed, and only one death occurred overnight rather than two.
That's more or less the sum of my lines of thinking right now, though I feel like Cyndarin and Luce could probably stand some scrutiny. And from the perspective of others, probably myself as well.
Thoughts? New info?
So many investigative roles...